Full transcript
0:00Hi, this is Peter Cone and you're
0:01listening to Finding Freedom. This
0:03episode I get to speak to Joe on a topic
0:06that I consider to be one of the most
0:08sensitive for all humans and something
0:09that I assert is going to really touch
0:11all of you because it really appeals to
0:13one of the main characteristics of what
0:15it is to be human, which is at times in
0:17our lives where we feel rejected, not
0:20wanted, and the distinct feeling of
0:22shame and hurt that comes with any
0:24feeling of isolation. So I thank Joe for
0:26her courage in sharing the times that
0:28she's felt not even seen or even
0:31recognized so that you might find that
0:33part within each of you and discover
0:35that that is just an aspect of the human
0:37conditioning and in fact the opportunity
0:39[music] for us to develop even more love
0:41for ourself. I hope you enjoy this
0:43episode of finding freedom and as part
0:45of my commitment to you to step into
0:47this new iteration of what it is to be a
0:492.0 human in this 2.0 in a world where
0:52we can live from freedom, love,
0:53possibility, vitality, and abundance.
0:55And above all, find more freedom.
0:59>> Welcome to uh finding freedom. And uh I
1:03know you have a tattoo. Do you want to
1:05show the folks at home?
1:06>> It's meant to be a container, two sides
1:09of a square.
1:10>> Just the symbol to mean all of it.
1:13Include all of it.
1:14>> To make space for all of it. Okay. I
1:16love that. So, just for those listening,
1:18if you could just let us know the main
1:20thing that you're keen to look at. I
1:23know it's in the arena of relationships,
1:25but I'd love for you to just explain
1:27where you're at so I can both hold space
1:29for you, the container like on your arm,
1:31and everyone at home can start to get
1:33related.
1:34>> Mhm.
1:36>> Sure. So, my submission is sort of
1:38centered around an experience I had two
1:41or three years ago.
1:43>> Mhm. where I saw a text message about me
1:46or I saw a text conversation about me
1:49>> and I sort of registered it loosely and
1:53then the following day a few of the
1:55words stuck out and every time I thought
1:58about those words
2:00I would get a sensation not a nice
2:03sensation that would go down the back of
2:05my neck to my shoulders and then it
2:07would sort of shoot to my stomach.
2:09>> Mhm. And there was a period of about 10
2:1210 days to two weeks where I couldn't
2:15eat. I struggled to get out of bed. I
2:17felt paralyzed in my own body, which
2:20sounds weird, but it this thing would
2:22just
2:23like I would go into brace sort of and
2:26then sort of lie in the fetal position
2:28and not move basically all day.
2:30>> Yeah, I get it.
2:31>> I can say more on that. But in terms of
2:33present day, it's not so dramatic. But I
2:37sort of feel the the micro versions of
2:40it in that I'm I get a buildup sometimes
2:43of this like blackness in my mind of my
2:46body which doesn't really have any
2:48language, but the closest I've come to
2:50is like no one cares or no one's coming.
2:53>> Yeah.
2:54>> If I think about it too much, it builds
2:56up and I get to the same place in my
2:57body of feeling paralyzed. So I've I've
3:00come pretty good at trying to escape my
3:02own mind.
3:03>> Yeah. which is what I did on repeat back
3:06then. I would go for really long drives,
3:09put a podcast on, usually you really
3:12loud in my car.
3:14Uh just anything to distract me from
3:16thinking about those words which I'm
3:18guessing point to something a lot
3:20deeper.
3:21>> For sure. No, I get it. And I know
3:22that's a horrible feeling and can be
3:25very heavy and depressing and um
3:27hopeless. You know, you obviously said
3:29powerless as well, but to give context,
3:32what what were the words you read and in
3:34what regard was it? It was the end of a
3:36relationship or
3:38>> it was I'll change the I'll change the
3:41name, but it was a guy's name.
3:43>> Yeah.
3:43>> Say John. It said John doesn't even like
3:46her.
3:47>> Meaning me.
3:48>> Yeah.
3:49>> It was a guy that I'd just been on a
3:50date with. So, there was more to the
3:53conversation, but those were the words
3:54that stuck out. And
3:58where I get stuck is
4:02why do why does something seemingly so
4:04small and juvenile uh elicit such a
4:09[snorts] huge response in my body?
4:11>> Yeah.
4:12>> And so I don't
4:14[clears throat] I have tried to talk
4:15about it like I went to therapy. I tried
4:17to tell my mom. I emailed some friends
4:19and was
4:20>> as transparent as I I could be about
4:22what had happened. But it was just this
4:24shame of like
4:26as I said in my video, I know I would
4:27never take my own life,
4:29>> but those words would do something where
4:31it got to the point where this thing
4:33would overcome my mind and I wasn't in
4:36control of it anymore
4:38>> and I didn't know what I would do under
4:41its control.
4:42>> Yeah.
4:42>> Um because someone didn't like me
4:44because a boy didn't like me. [laughter]
4:46>> Yeah. No, I understand. It's one date.
4:48But then if you want to expand on that,
4:49what is the concern like the bigger
4:51picture as it relates to relationships
4:53as a whole and and Joe's future?
4:56>> There's a few. I think the main one is
4:58that that I will miss or that I do miss
5:02the love that is around me and the
5:04acceptance that is around me because I'm
5:06looking through whatever that lens is.
5:08Yeah. And
5:08>> so I can't see
5:12realness and real friendship and real
5:14people who do
5:16like me or accept me.
5:19>> Yeah.
5:19>> And that I won't be able to see, find,
5:23or sustain a real connection or a
5:26relationship.
5:27>> The idea that you're just going to spend
5:29the rest of your life by yourself,
5:31>> that's definitely a fear and it's really
5:33embarrassing to say. It's in the
5:35forefront of my mind every day, all day.
5:37It's
5:38>> It's just there.
5:40>> I get how embarrassing that is to say,
5:42to use your words, but I I think you'd
5:44be pleasantly surprised. Might seem like
5:46an oxymoron in this case, but how many
5:48people feel the same, right? Meaning
5:51that they also have that fear. And they
5:52might be in a relationship that right
5:54now they know is not really great or
5:56that they want to leave, but they're too
5:57scared to leave for the fear of that
6:00they might then end up being by
6:01themselves for the rest of their life,
6:03too.
6:04>> H
6:04So, I really, you know, commend you on
6:07having the courage to come and have this
6:09conversation with me and I'm excited to
6:11show you what's on the other side of it.
6:13But I do, at least for now, want to make
6:15space for and, you know, have compassion
6:18for everybody who has this part of them
6:20as the human experience, right? Which is
6:22who am I to end up in a beautiful
6:24relationship? Who's going to pick me?
6:25Who's going to love me? I'm going to be
6:27by myself. Even if I meet someone, it's
6:29not going to work out. They won't like
6:30me. Like, you know, your your friend
6:32John. Um what just out of curiosity
6:36where where did this transpire? Like cuz
6:38this was a text message on someone
6:40else's phone. It wasn't obviously to
6:42you. Like so you said you saw this
6:44message. Like how how did that occur?
6:48>> Uh so John actually showed it to me. He
6:52he was showing me a conversation between
6:54two mutual friends who were having a
6:56good old gossip about us.
6:59>> Oh. Oh. So okay.
7:00>> He was giving me a lift home. Yeah.
7:04And was he particularly showing you that
7:06part or you just happened to see that?
7:08>> Those I he showed me the whole thing.
7:11The context was just like these guys are
7:14sticking their nose in when it's not
7:15their business. But those were the words
7:17that stuck out and stuck with me. So he
7:19wasn't yet specifically showing me that
7:21part though.
7:22>> Got it. Okay. Okay. Fine. So you know
7:25you're smart, you're savvy. You've
7:26listened to my work. you drive off into
7:28the countryside and crank my podcast at
7:31loud, you know, volume to try and ignore
7:33the chatter of your mind. What would you
7:35say might be one of the stories that Joe
7:37has about herself if this is, you know,
7:39so devastating to you, which I totally
7:42understand and have compassion for?
7:48>> I don't know, which is why I'm here, but
7:51I'm guessing logically it's something
7:54in the realm of not being wanted or
7:57picked.
7:58>> Yeah.
8:00And do you have any and and that's
8:02accurate and that's where I would go. Do
8:04you have any points of reference from
8:06your own history, you know, growing up?
8:09It sounds like you have, you know, you
8:11spoke to your mom, you said, so I'm
8:12guessing you have a caring mom at least.
8:14I don't know the situation with dad but
8:16you know give us any in indications that
8:19this might have been a story that you
8:21developed somewhere along the line
8:24school parents
8:27>> so I don't have one particular sort of
8:31standout memory but there are lots of
8:33little ones where I had the same sort of
8:35like sensation
8:38>> which was I would notice my beautiful
8:41best friends get looked at
8:43>> every Like when we walked into a public
8:45space and I would notice that it was
8:48never me.
8:49>> Mhm.
8:50>> You know, no one said anything nasty. It
8:52was more just like
8:55[snorts] I know I don't fit the mold
8:57right now of what is
9:00attractive and
9:03>> yeah,
9:04>> desirable.
9:06>> Yeah.
9:06>> So, I've had that Yeah. through my teens
9:08and 20s and now 30s in social occasions.
9:12That's what I notice I'm looking out for
9:14>> when I arrive, during, and when I leave.
9:18>> Many memories like that. And I've always
9:20had really beautiful best friends. So,
9:23>> it happened a lot. And I remember there
9:25was one instance at music college where
9:28my best friend at the time, she got hit
9:31on by a girl and I was like, "Fuck sake,
9:34like I cannot gut a break." [laughter]
9:39>> Not just men picking your friends. Now
9:40even women are wanting my friends but
9:42not me. Right.
9:44>> Yeah. It's funny now but it really hit
9:46me at the time.
9:48>> Mhm.
9:48>> So that Yeah. There's been many uh many
9:51instances like that.
9:53>> Yeah.
9:53>> Yeah. The not not wanted, not picked. I
9:56can hear that. And and just without
9:59going there too much because I know it
10:00hurts. But what what's it like to live
10:02inside of that the who Joe is is the one
10:05that's not picked. She's the one that's
10:07not wanted. Everyone else is being given
10:09the love and adoration and attention.
10:17It's okay. It's important to feel.
10:25[snorts] I don't know what how to
10:27articulate what it feels like.
10:30Like it's got to the point
10:33in the sort of cascade of how it happens
10:34that there aren't any there's no
10:36language anymore. It's just like I see
10:38no. I see no. I see no. [snorts]
10:41>> Mhm.
10:42>> And I'm I'm in adult language,
10:45separation. Like I'm just observing the
10:48world around me. People getting
10:50together, people getting married, having
10:53kids. [snorts]
10:54>> Yeah.
10:55>> People in a new relationship,
10:58another one,
10:59>> right?
11:00>> Um I wish I had more language for it,
11:03but it's just
11:04>> No, you're doing great. and beyond
11:06language as a woman. I really want you
11:08just to feel it like what does that feel
11:10like? Like you know, okay, even the last
11:12time you saw your friend who was picked
11:13up or hit on by a girl, you know, and
11:15then you've got all the other episodes
11:17where all these guys are hitting on,
11:19friends are getting married, friends
11:20have got partners. What does it just
11:22feel like to be the one that's left out?
11:29>> [ __ ]
11:30>> Yeah. No, it's fine. It does. It feels
11:32[ __ ] Yeah.
11:35Is that where you feel it in your
11:36stomach?
11:40>> Yeah. I think
11:43the closest I've come in language where
11:46I've really felt it like that kick in
11:47the stomach is that I'm a joke. I
11:49remember sharing those words with a
11:51friend.
11:52>> Mhm.
11:52>> And it's not I know I used rejection,
11:54but it's not even it's like it's not
11:56even rejection because you have to be at
11:58least be registered or considered to
12:00then
12:01>> Yeah.
12:01>> be rejected. So,
12:03>> it's like not considered like invisible.
12:06>> That's what I was going to say. Forget
12:07rejection. You're not even considered.
12:09You're not
12:10>> Yeah. Not even seen. [laughter] Yeah.
12:12>> Yeah.
12:12>> Not even seen in the first place. No, I
12:15get it. Do you um just to
12:17[clears throat] give me some context? Um
12:19do you have siblings?
12:21>> Yes, I do. I have a brother. Younger
12:23brother.
12:23>> Younger brother. And do you remember
12:26like what's the age difference?
12:28>> Just over a year, year and a half. Not a
12:30big difference. No. Okay. Do you have
12:33any kind of memory of like what it was
12:35like when he arrived? Because sometimes
12:37when there's a younger sibling, the
12:38oldest one who only knows attention can,
12:42and again, I'm not leading the witness
12:43or trying to plant any seeds here, but
12:45can sometimes feel like, oh, I can
12:47distinctly remember as soon as my
12:49younger brother, younger sister arrived,
12:51I suddenly became sort of put to one
12:53side. Do you have any of that kind of
12:56experience?
12:58No, I
13:01I've I've thought about that in depth
13:03before when I was in therapy and they
13:05brought up a similar thing.
13:08>> Um
13:10actually to the point where I left
13:12because I just didn't resonate at all.
13:15So if if that is something then
13:19>> I' I have no recollection of it and it's
13:21>> right it's just deep
13:22>> never something I felt in my [snorts]
13:24childhood or [clears throat]
13:26>> adulthood.
13:27>> Yeah. Well, kudos to your parents then
13:29for because you know through no fault of
13:31their own, it's very common that parents
13:33start to put all of their attention on a
13:35young baby just because the baby needs
13:37more attention, you know, but given the
13:39closeness of your age, if it's older, if
13:41they're three, four year gap, you know,
13:43their 3 four year old can take a little
13:45bit more care of themselves. So, it can
13:47give the impression of being dismissed a
13:49little bit, but I don't hear that. So,
13:51that's great.
13:52>> So, so let's look at the aspirational
13:55part of this, right? like so not not not
13:57wanted, not seen, not even considered.
14:00Um, but clearly Joe would love a
14:02relationship, right?
14:05>> Yes. [laughter]
14:07>> I hate admitting that, but yes, for
14:09sure.
14:10>> Well, let's look at that. Why do you
14:11hate admitting that?
14:16>> Cuz it sounds needy and it feels like
14:21it's coming from an unhealthy pl like a
14:23desperate place. Yeah.
14:26>> And I,
14:28you know, it I have patterns of choosing
14:31people purely because they chose me or,
14:34you know, in some small way and I don't
14:36want to do that,
14:38>> right? No, I get it. So, let's just
14:40let's just do the old um hypotheticals
14:43for fun, right? So, let's just say, god
14:45forbid, there's some lunatic person out
14:47there who actually chooses Joe. You
14:49know, they've lost their mind.
14:51>> [laughter]
14:52>> They're like
14:52>> last resort.
14:54>> Last resort. They're desperate and it's
14:56like okay, [laughter]
14:58[gasps]
14:58messing with you obviously. So if but if
15:03we we work past this, which we're going
15:04to I mean I have absolutely zero doubt
15:07that this is going to completely
15:08radically change your life. But do
15:11[clears throat] you have aspirations to
15:12have your own family?
15:14>> Yeah.
15:14>> Yeah. You'd be a wonderful mom.
15:17>> So let's just look at that part, right?
15:20So, this is always uh so fun for me
15:24because,
15:25how do I phrase this? The way that
15:27people look at their situations tends to
15:29be not the place to look in the first
15:30place. So, for you, it's obvious, right?
15:32You go out, you're in a public space,
15:33you see your beautiful friends getting
15:35hit on or they have partners or they're
15:37married, they're talking about family,
15:38and then here's little old Joe. Woe is
15:40me. You know, no one's going to see me.
15:43No one's, you know, you've got this
15:44cognitive bias, meaning before you've
15:46even left your own building, your own
15:48home, there's the trepidation, right, of
15:51like, oh, well, I want to go out cuz I
15:53want to see my friends, but why would I
15:54go out cuz all I'm going to experience
15:56is, you know, this dismissal energy
15:58again. No one's going to notice me,
16:00right?
16:01>> Fair.
16:01>> Yeah. Yes. [snorts]
16:03>> So, I guess I have one question.
16:06For work, are you a fortune teller? Is
16:09that what you do for work?
16:10>> No. [laughter]
16:12Just just curious because you seem to
16:14have it all figured out about what's
16:16going on.
16:16>> I've got it all figured out. Yeah. No.
16:18>> Yeah.
16:18>> I have no idea.
16:20>> No. Which would be actually quite
16:22refreshing for you if you could start to
16:24live from there, right? Because I'm just
16:26going to be straight with you. Like do
16:27you absolutely know that for the rest of
16:29your life? You said you're 32 now or how
16:31old are you?
16:32>> 32. Yeah.
16:32>> 32. So for the rest of your life, do you
16:35know that no one's going to pick Joe?
16:37>> No.
16:39>> No. But can you see that
16:41>> does happen ironically?
16:43>> Pardon?
16:44>> It does happen sometimes, but
16:46>> yeah, shocker.
16:47>> I can't see [laughter] it.
16:50[gasps]
16:51>> Well, here's the irony, right? Like, so
16:53there's there's a 8 billion people out
16:55there. Like, if we did the math, I don't
16:57know what it is, you know, like let's
16:58say roughly half of them are male. So,
17:00there's like 4 billion. Of course,
17:02they're across the gamut of ages, you
17:04know, anywhere between 0 to 18. I'm
17:06going to guess you don't skew below 28
17:08or 27, you know, you don't want to date
17:11a boy. So, you know, that probably
17:13eradicates a good third of that. So,
17:16maybe down to three billion. And then at
17:17the other end of the spectrum, you know,
17:1950 plus or whatever. So, maybe there's
17:21another two. But there's probably a good
17:22billion out there that, you know, at
17:24least let's just say 500 million, you
17:27know, men that are of suitable age. We
17:29could rule out different belief systems,
17:31alcoholics, you know, drug addicts,
17:33maybe certain religious tendencies. I
17:35don't know what you're into, but by the
17:37time we get down to it, you know,
17:39there's definitely a few million
17:41[laughter] men who could be potential
17:43suitors, right?
17:44>> Yeah. Yes.
17:46>> So, the irony is that it's not the
17:48absence of potential people out there.
17:50It's the proclivity you have, the
17:52tendency, the cognitive bias for you to
17:55skew your view. Right. So, it's it's
17:59your view of you, which is ironically
18:01your relationship of you.
18:04>> Yeah. So, you know, I'm just going to
18:06cut to the chase. So, you said right at
18:08the beginning, one of the things you do,
18:09and I listen, I have all the sympathy,
18:11compassion in the world. I get it. You
18:13know, only child, my parents died. I
18:15could definitely lean into feeling
18:17completely isolated, alone, no one's
18:19picking me. Wasn't so much in that vein,
18:21but it's definitely a feeling of
18:22complete separation, which is horrible,
18:24right? So, I get it. Now, when you feel
18:28that and it's the stomach and it's the
18:30weight across your neck and your
18:31shoulders and it feels hopeless and you
18:33don't want to listen to that part of
18:35you, you said you maybe go for a drive
18:38and you'll listen to a podcast or you
18:39want something loud to kind of drown
18:41that out, right?
18:43>> Yeah, for sure.
18:44>> So, now look at that behavior
18:48and I'm just going to be straight with
18:49you. What are you doing to that part of
18:52you with that choice of action?
18:56avoiding it.
18:58>> What else?
19:00>> Shutting it down, not listening,
19:03wanting it to go away, dismissing it.
19:07>> So, can we start to maybe make the
19:10correlation?
19:13Why am I asking you that question? See,
19:15this isn't Joe. This is a part of your
19:17conditioning. Everything that confines a
19:20human being, the limits, the
19:21constraints, these are conversations.
19:23It's not the essence of who you are.
19:25Like in in this case, your perceiving
19:26self definitely is I'm not wanted. I'm
19:29not picked. I'm not even considered. I'm
19:32less than. You know, it's all in that
19:33realm, right?
19:34>> Yeah.
19:35>> That's a story. But is that are those
19:38conversations who you are?
19:42>> Is that who you are?
19:44>> No.
19:45>> No. They're just conversations. But
19:47again, just to reiterate, to strengthen
19:49it, what are you what is your approach
19:51to those conversations? Bearing in mind
19:53what you said about driving and
19:54listening to a loud podcast
19:58>> that I don't want it.
20:00>> So, can you see the irony? There's a
20:04part of you that feels not wanted and
20:06your approach to it is to reinforce that
20:09you don't want it by trying to drown it
20:12out, not listen to it, make it wrong.
20:15>> Yeah.
20:17I guess I'm I'm
20:21It's scary because I don't know what
20:23where it's going to take me. But yeah.
20:27>> Okay. So So now I'm going to come full
20:30circle to the method of my madness and
20:32how I do what I do. Right. So I asked
20:34earlier, you know,
20:35>> madness,
20:36>> complete madness, wizardry, should we
20:38call it then.
20:39>> Yes.
20:41>> So your desire, aspiration, 32, you want
20:45to have a family. You want to obviously,
20:46you know, whether you get married or
20:47whatever, you have a partner, but you
20:49you'd love to be a mom, right? So, let's
20:52cut to the future, you know. Let's say I
20:54I'm confident you'll meet someone within
20:55a year easily. You could easily have
20:57kids within 3 years, you know. So, let's
20:59say you're 35, you've had your first
21:01baby, and now cut to you're 40, you got
21:04a 5-year-old, they just started
21:06kindergarten,
21:08and by virtue of being a child in an
21:10environment with a lot of other kids
21:12that don't know what the hell they're
21:13saying, but they've learned things or
21:14they're mean or whatever, your your
21:16beautiful little daughter comes home and
21:18she's crying,
21:20right? And it's because she wasn't
21:22picked for whatever was going on at
21:24kindergarten or primary school or
21:26whatever the first grade was, right? She
21:28wasn't included. She She didn't make the
21:31music. She didn't make the cheerleading.
21:32She didn't Whatever it is, fill in the
21:34blank, right?
21:35>> So, she comes home. It's your daughter
21:38and she feels completely rejected,
21:41excluded, not even considered.
21:44How how what is your response to her?
21:54Big hug. Really sorry.
21:58It's not true.
22:04>> What emotion do you would you want to
22:07her to presence from you? She comes
22:10home. She's devastated. She wasn't
22:12picked for something. She'd felt left
22:13out. You've hugged her. That's a
22:15physical expression. But what emotion
22:16would you want to her to feel the most
22:19from her own mom?
22:22>> Presence, care,
22:25love, attention. Yeah, let's just stick
22:27with love.
22:30>> Yeah,
22:30>> I'm going to guess even though I've only
22:33known you for whatever 20 30 minutes
22:36that you would even feel that kind of
22:39love whether you, you know, categorize
22:41it as love, compassion, sympathy,
22:43empathy, but they're to me all bed
22:44fellows. Even if you saw a friend of
22:47yours, this beautiful friend who's had
22:49married and her daughter is sad, you
22:50would feel that. That's what I present.
22:52That's what I see in you. let alone your
22:54own daughter who's devastated. I I can't
22:57if I'm in the kitchen or wherever when
22:59she walks home, all I see is you maybe
23:02even in tears picking her up and saying,
23:03"Oh, honey, it's okay. I love you so
23:05much."
23:07>> Can you see that's a natural response,
23:09right?
23:10>> Yeah. Yeah.
23:11>> Now, let's take that little girl and put
23:14her inside you as your own nervous
23:16system right now.
23:19Doesn't feel wanted, doesn't feel
23:21included, doesn't even feel considered.
23:23And what are you doing to her?
23:29>> Same thing.
23:31Not including
23:32>> What have you been doing?
23:34>> Not including her.
23:35>> Not just not not not only in not not
23:38including her, but trying to drown her
23:41out.
23:44>> Yeah.
23:44>> So, this is what you're doing. Follow
23:46along. Right. Your daughter comes home.
23:47She's been excluded. She's devastated.
23:49She's crying. She feels absolutely
23:51hopeless, useless, not even considered.
23:54You're like, "Honey, I've got just the
23:55solution. I want to hear all about it.
23:57Let's get in the car." You put her in
23:59the car, and you blast music as she's
24:01trying, the little 5-year-old is trying
24:02to talk to her mom, and you're not even
24:04looking at her.
24:10>> Yeah. I don't know how.
24:15You don't know how one
24:19>> I don't know how to be with that.
24:21>> I know. It's okay. But I want you to
24:24consider this is your training ground.
24:28You You're being given the greatest gift
24:30right now for the precursor to all
24:33relationships. I guarantee you right now
24:36as I say these words and the millions of
24:38people hopefully around the world who
24:39are getting to listen to this
24:40conversation, there's not one of them.
24:43Many are already in tears, but there's
24:45not one of them who doesn't relate to
24:47the feeling of at times in their life,
24:50maybe right now, feeling not wanted.
24:53Not one. Do you understand that?
24:56>> Yes.
24:57>> This is an intrinsic part of the human
24:59operating system that doesn't work. Is
25:01why we suffer, right? like limitation,
25:04fear, suffering, disease, scarcity.
25:06These are the inherent pillars of the
25:08current operating system that we don't
25:11by default feel that we're like God's
25:13gift to relationships. We don't by
25:15default think that everybody loves us.
25:16We don't by default think that, you
25:18know, we're like the greatest thing
25:20since sliced bread, you know. No, people
25:23by default think that there's something
25:25wrong with them. They're not wanted.
25:26They're not loved. So, yeah. I hate to
25:29break it to you, but welcome to the
25:30human experience.
25:32>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
25:33>> What better what better backdrop against
25:37which you get to learn how to find love
25:40and compassion than your own stories of
25:43inadequacy?
25:46>> Yeah, that's the
25:50that's the integration. That's the game.
25:53>> Well, let's look at the tattoo again.
25:56Hold it up and tell us what that tattoo
25:59represents.
26:04It represents
26:08the inclusion of all of it.
26:11>> Seems like there's a little bit of
26:13>> the little girl that feels rejected.
26:15Yeah.
26:16>> Oops. [snorts]
26:17You have a tattoo of a cup, a chalice,
26:20whatever you call it, on your wrist that
26:22for you is representative of the
26:26beautiful inclusive energy which I call
26:28love. that is accepting of all parts
26:32only that you have a tattoo like
26:34literally permanently on your wrist and
26:36you're saying yes this is what I stand
26:37for I include all parts oh just not the
26:40part of me that doesn't feel included
26:42[laughter]
26:44>> yeah I get the irony of that yeah
26:47>> yeah not only the irony it's the
26:49complete barricade to you finding love
26:52with other people
26:55of my expressions early on I said if you
26:56don't love and accept yourself what
26:58makes you think other people should
27:02I mean feel that that should be a bit of
27:04an ouch.
27:07>> Yeah.
27:09>> So you're walking around saying who you
27:11are and again it's not who you are but
27:13your conditioning your energetic
27:14signature the way that you present to
27:16the world unconsciously is I'm
27:17unacceptable. I'm not even considered.
27:19I'm definitely not wanted. That's who I
27:22am. Hi, nice to meet you. And then
27:23you're surprised that there isn't this
27:26plethora of men just lining up to be
27:28your suitor.
27:31>> Yeah.
27:34>> Now, I don't deny that it hurts, but we
27:36want to be able to shift from victim,
27:38which is the mode you're in, to
27:39responsible responsibility.
27:42Right now, as you've probably heard me
27:44say this before without even thinking
27:46about it, because you haven't until I
27:48ask a question. Do you have on your
27:50physical body anywhere a scar of any
27:53kind? Small, larger, or indifferent?
27:56>> Yeah.
27:57>> Whichever one you're willing to share.
27:59Where do you have one?
28:00>> Oh, uh,
28:05>> got loads. I have one on my finger from
28:08a like a like a knife cut.
28:10>> Okay, great. Which finger?
28:13>> This one.
28:14>> Okay. Your left right index finger.
28:17Okay, great.
28:18>> Index finger. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, great.
28:20So, before I asked you where you had if
28:22you had any scars or where were they,
28:23were you thinking of that scar on your
28:25right index finger?
28:27>> No.
28:27>> No. But but you're not trying to get rid
28:29of it, right? You're not going for a
28:31drive in the country cranking the music
28:33and throwing paint over your right hand
28:35so you don't see it.
28:37>> No. No.
28:38>> It's allowed to be there.
28:39>> Yeah.
28:40>> So, here's a question. Can you with me
28:43right now start for the first time ever
28:45in your life to allow the part of you
28:47that feels not wanted, not considered to
28:50be there?
28:55>> Yeah.
28:58>> That's all it's asking for. See, you've
29:00got it as though you're looking for
29:02somebody to want you, right? You're
29:03looking for somebody to pick you. You're
29:05looking for somebody to recognize you in
29:07the outside world.
29:10>> Yes.
29:11Yeah. Sorry. Yeah.
29:13>> Yeah. Desperately.
29:16But the outside world is a mirror of the
29:18inside world. And the inside world is
29:20you're completely denying, rejecting,
29:22dismissing, pushing away, ignoring,
29:24overriding the part of you that wants to
29:26be picked.
29:30>> Yeah.
29:31>> So, here's the irony. The access to
29:33being loved and accepted in the world is
29:35for you to love and accept the part of
29:37the part of you that feels not wanted.
29:42That's the gift of that part of the
29:44code.
29:47>> Yeah.
29:47>> If you wanted to get a strong right
29:49bicep, what might you do?
29:54>> Work out.
29:56>> Specifically, if you wanted to get a
29:58strong right bicep, what might you do?
30:02uh lift a dumbbell.
30:03>> Yeah. On the right arm, right?
30:05>> Yeah.
30:07>> So, if you want to get a strong right
30:10bicep, you know that you need the
30:12resistance, the adversity of the
30:14heaviness of a dumbbell in your right
30:16hand.
30:18Do you see that?
30:20>> Yeah. I I I
30:23suppress
30:25most negative emotions, which is why I
30:28got which is why the message of
30:30including all of it is so freeing
30:32because I don't subconsciously do that.
30:36>> Okay, I know. But this is what we're
30:38working on right now and why there's so
30:39much resistance, right? To stay with the
30:41metaphor, you know that if you're going
30:43to want to strengthen your right bicep,
30:45you have to put some sort of weight
30:46significant in your right hand and do
30:49curls, right? That's how you're going to
30:51strengthen that bicep.
30:54>> Yeah. Okay.
30:56>> How do you think we're going to help Joe
30:58to become better at being empathetic,
31:01compassionate, all accepting, and allow
31:02and make space for all of it? What would
31:05be one of the quotequote equivalent
31:07dumbbells for her to be able to learn
31:09that capacity to love?
31:15Um,
31:17I've had experiences of it with friends,
31:20with like people who can hold that space
31:22for me. I guess I have to practice on my
31:25own.
31:26>> Well, you can get rid of the guest.
31:27That's the only thing that's missing.
31:29You have a tattoo that says make space
31:31for all of it. And yet, you're not doing
31:34that.
31:37Like,
31:38>> no. Sorry. I
31:40>> like you're a sweetheart. I don't deny
31:42your capacity to love, but your capacity
31:45to love right now is being completely
31:47compromised by your denial of a part of
31:49your humanity.
31:54Like you said, you suppress negative
31:56feelings. I get it. How do you think
31:57that's going to work in a relationship?
32:01>> Yeah, I know. I know. I don't
32:04>> Are you going to meet some guy who never
32:06gets negative? You're going to meet a
32:07guy who's just like the poster child for
32:09positivity, optimism, you know, happy
32:11golucky all the time.
32:15Do you think that guy is going to be
32:16like a real real human?
32:23No negative thing emotions, no worries,
32:26no stress,
32:27>> gets laid off from work and is just like
32:29coming home bouncing like the, you know,
32:31[ __ ] at the end of the rainbow and
32:33life is good. Or do you think that you
32:34might have a partner from time to time
32:36who's going to deal with the stress of
32:38heartache? You know, that maybe his
32:40parents have gone into hospice, god
32:41forbid, one of them's died, maybe his
32:43brother's just gotten cancer, maybe he
32:45gets laid off from work.
32:50>> Yeah,
32:51>> probably more realistic.
32:52>> I would never want to to put that on
32:53anyone.
32:55>> Yeah, but you do it readily to yourself
32:5724/7.
32:59[laughter]
33:02>> Yeah. No, I get that. I just
33:07I I I mean I feel a lot and I feel a lot
33:11alone. So when I do feel stuff I I shut
33:15the door and I guess I only feel safe to
33:18do that on my own. But then it kind of
33:20keeps coming back. So it's not resolved
33:23if I'm having
33:23>> Why do you think it keeps coming back?
33:26>> I don't know. Cuz I felt it a lot.
33:29>> No, you felt it with resistance.
33:33Okay.
33:35>> You felt it with lack of acceptance.
33:38Imagine again your daughter, she's come
33:41home from kindergarten, first grade,
33:43whatever. Same sort of scenario. And she
33:45has something to show you like that is
33:47really, really, really important to her.
33:50But you're the mom and maybe you have a
33:52newborn and they're 6 months and you're
33:54breastfeeding. And mommy, mommy, mommy.
33:56Your daughter who's five or six is
33:58trying to get your attention, but you
34:00have other things you're attending to.
34:02And then your husband comes home and he
34:03wants something and you have to put food
34:05together and you're in the middle of
34:06doing laundry, but your daughter keeps
34:08coming back. Why does she keep coming
34:10back?
34:12>> Cuz she hasn't been heard.
34:13>> Bingo.
34:15That's all that's happening is there's
34:18the part of you that is so hurt, that
34:20feels so rejected, that feels unseen,
34:22not even recognized, that keeps coming
34:24back because you haven't made space for
34:26it yet. It's not included in that tattoo
34:28on your on your wrist.
34:31Can I ask a question?
34:33>> You of course you can.
34:36>> For those times where I have felt it
34:40like in its fullness
34:42>> where I feel safe enough for to not for
34:44it to not go anywhere too dark.
34:46>> Yeah.
34:46>> Is that just that I haven't
34:49>> that hasn't actually been in its
34:50fullness yet? Like I haven't gone fully
34:52there.
34:53>> Two things. You've gone fully there in
34:55terms of feeling it. So imagine you're
34:57walking along
35:00um just a pathway and you come across in
35:02the woods a big well like a big hole and
35:05you find out that you you you can hear a
35:07voice and you can't see cuz it's very
35:08dark and it's very deep but your friend
35:11is at the bottom of the well you're like
35:12holy [ __ ] like what are you doing down
35:14there John let's keep John alive for now
35:17[laughter]
35:19right
35:20and even though he didn't like you know
35:22you care enough that [laughter] you know
35:25he's
35:26rescue John still. No, I don't know
35:29anyone called John. So, go [ __ ]
35:31yourself. [laughter]
35:33>> Go [ __ ] yourself, John. [gasps]
35:35>> Nothing [clears throat] great. You just
35:36stay in the well. Going to turn up the
35:39podcast with me [laughter] in your in
35:40your earbuds, right? Yeah. No. So, you
35:43got a friend who you genuinely care
35:45who's down the well.
35:46>> Feeling the part of you that feels
35:48rejected is jumping down the well and
35:50being with them.
35:53>> That's Yeah, that's funny.
35:56>> [laughter]
35:57>> funny but not right. Yeah. You're all
36:00you're doing is you're being in the
36:02emotion. You're being in the story of
36:05not rejected. You're feeling sorry for
36:07yourself versus this is the distinction
36:11recognizing that part of your
36:13conditioning is simply part of the human
36:18disposition.
36:19It's not you.
36:20>> That's true.
36:22>> There you go. It's
36:27And you thought you were smart.
36:29[laughter]
36:31>> I know none of it's true, but I haven't.
36:34It's not true. But it is nonetheless the
36:37mechanism for you to embrace your
36:40humanity, which is one of the biggest
36:43and I would assert only important
36:45precursors to having a good relationship
36:49because you can't be with another human
36:50if you can't be with your own humanness.
36:55It's so juvenile. [snorts]
36:57>> It is. And that's why I just said I
37:00choose my words very carefully and very
37:02consciously. This is my dear the
37:05opportunity, the opportunity for you to
37:08practice motherhood right now as a
37:10precursor to you being an actual mother
37:12in the real world
37:14and you've been pushing away your
37:16daughter. It doesn't make you a bad
37:17person. It just means you weren't quite
37:18ready or you didn't get it. You were
37:20just feeling with her as opposed to
37:22holding her feelings.
37:26Do you see the difference?
37:28It's no different than that scar on your
37:30right index finger.
37:35>> So, who is it that decides that she's
37:38worth holding?
37:39>> You, the essence of you, the conscious
37:41self, the being, the soul, the spirit.
37:44Love, the energy of love
37:47makes space for everybody. And
37:49especially somebody who's hurt.
37:52[laughter]
37:53What are you talking about?
37:54>> It's so funny that I have this. I don't
37:56even care.
37:56>> I mean, hello. That's why I keep [ __ ]
37:58referencing. It's like you got a
37:59freaking tattoo on your own forearm that
38:03is representing the very antithesis of
38:05the energy you claim to want to be.
38:12I didn't know I was doing that. I
38:14thought I was I [laughter] thought by
38:16feeling it that was including it.
38:19No,
38:20>> but it's not.
38:21>> It's not.
38:24I love that you have the ability to feel
38:26it.
38:28>> That's beautiful. That shows incredible
38:30compassion, amazing sympathy and
38:33empathy. You have beautiful qualities.
38:35You'll be an incredible friend. You'll
38:37be an incredible heart partner. You'll
38:38be an incredible mother. But you just
38:41collapsed your feeling with somebody
38:43else's versus making space for them,
38:46holding them
38:50and distinguishing it as a part of you.
38:52It's like you getting upset because you
38:54have two arms. It's like what? You know,
38:57that's an inherent part of the human
38:59genetic, you know, code of having two
39:01arms in our anatomy. It's like you don't
39:03get upset about it. You you doesn't even
39:05until I even pose that question, you're
39:07like, well, that's bizarre. Why would I
39:08get upset about that? That's just part
39:10of being human.
39:12I'm so upset my beautiful friends have
39:14three arms. [laughter] It's like,
39:18no, you know that that's part of the
39:19human anatomy. Well, guess what? Part of
39:21the human anatomy emotionally and
39:23psychologically is the feeling of
39:25inadequacy, not wanted, not not loved.
39:28That's just part of it.
39:32>> So now it becomes whoopde-doo. Oh yeah,
39:35there's a part of me by the way that
39:36feels not wanted. And sometimes it might
39:37show up in our relationship, especially,
39:39you know, when you're with whoever's
39:41next and they are seemingly distracted
39:44or they haven't responded or they
39:47haven't come home at the time they said
39:48they would. You know, in a beautiful
39:50vulnerable relationship, you could say,
39:52"Honey, I know this is my thing, but
39:56sometimes when I don't hear from you
39:58when you said you'd call or it feels
40:00like you're not giving me attention, I
40:02go into the part of me, the part of me
40:04that feels not wanted. I know that's
40:06mine, but I just want to share that with
40:08you as somebody who would probably love
40:10to hold space with me for that part of
40:13me. Do you see?
40:15>> Yeah.
40:16>> That's beautiful. That's vulnerability.
40:18>> That's a very calm way of putting it.
40:19[laughter]
40:20>> Versus your desperation screaming
40:23through the countryside with a podcast
40:25wearing. Yeah. [laughter]
40:29>> But can you see how beautiful, powerful,
40:31and loving that is now? you're making
40:33space for you and with the right partner
40:34and and if that partner dismisses that,
40:36well then that that's not the partner
40:38you want to be with. You want somebody
40:39who can include your humanness, but they
40:42don't stand a chance to include your
40:44humanness if you even don't.
40:49[snorts] How do I include the part
40:50that's
40:52scared
40:55it's
40:57it's going to kill me? That's the part
41:00I'm scared of that I'm that I'm really
41:02trying to drown out because I know
41:04that's not true. But it's really
41:07>> uncomfortable to feel.
41:10>> Yeah. Well, listen, it's the same part.
41:13If there is a part of us that by design,
41:16which is the human part, feels not
41:19wanted, rejected, not considered, not
41:21even seen, then its experience is
41:25there's no point being here.
41:27primordial imperative of a human being
41:29of any mammal is to survive. We want to
41:31belong. We need to be part of the tribe.
41:33Right? So if it feels and from you the
41:37host or the hostess not wanted, it's
41:39like well then [ __ ] it. I might as well
41:41be out of there.
41:43My own my own being doesn't want this
41:46part of me. The very fabric of who you
41:49are and why you're here is to integrate
41:51these parts of you. And you as the
41:53hostess of your own conditioning is
41:55rejecting your own conditioning.
41:58So the death is to the part of you to
42:00that part of you that feels not seen,
42:03not wanted, not even considered. That's
42:06the death to that part of you. Here's
42:08the irony. Death happens through
42:10integration.
42:14That's the hardest part I think of the
42:17the levels is the
42:19letting it be rather than letting it go.
42:22>> Yeah. Right. Yeah. You've heard me say
42:24before, the ego doesn't want to be
42:26healed. It wants to be held.
42:29>> Like it's the same thing with your right
42:31index finger scar. You didn't try to get
42:34rid of it.
42:36You didn't try and kill it. It's there.
42:38You integrated it. So that means it's
42:39now gone. But it's there. But it's gone
42:42because you you allowed it.
42:44>> We're back to the [ __ ] tattoo on your
42:46wrist again.
42:49>> Yeah.
42:52>> So, it's really I love me, which
42:54includes all the parts of me, including
42:57the part of me that doesn't feel
42:58lovable. What What better mechanism to
43:02develop self-love? If you loved every
43:04part of you, if listen, I with no slight
43:07towards your beautiful friends, whoever
43:09they are, and I don't know if they're
43:10beautiful, that's just the cognitive
43:12biased lens that you look through. But,
43:14you know, let's for argument sake say
43:16they are and they've got all this
43:17attention. I feel sorry for them
43:21more so than, you know, for you because
43:23you've got the instrument, you've got
43:25the mechanism to learn true self-love.
43:27If all they've gotten is love, and I've
43:29seen this so many times with people I've
43:31worked with who are famous, who are
43:32rich, who are gorgeous, who are models
43:34or whatever, they'd never learn. They
43:36never had to learn to make space for
43:38their own humanity because everyone else
43:39did it for them.
43:42>> Yeah, I see that.
43:43>> Then it shows up when they're 40, 50,
43:45and things fell apart. Now they really
43:47are a [ __ ] mess because they didn't
43:49learn the skills.
43:51So maybe it's like, "Thank you, Lord,
43:53for not having this like line of dudes
43:55trying to like possess me so that I can
43:58learn to make space for myself first."
44:04>> Yeah.
44:06>> I tell you, listen, if you really get
44:08what I'm telling you, this is going to
44:09happen so [ __ ] quickly for you.
44:14Like, you could meet someone next week
44:16and that could be the partner for the
44:18rest of your life. If you really embody
44:20the energy of complete inclusion, of
44:22allowing all of it, all parts of you,
44:24those that particularly feel rejected,
44:26not seen, not wanted, you just stepped
44:29into the mastery of relationship.
44:34Cuz how on earth do you think you're
44:35going to make space for the little boy
44:36and the guy you're going to meet who
44:38feels he's not good enough and because
44:39he doesn't earn enough money compared to
44:41his friends who are millionaires? or,
44:43oh, my buddy just bought this really
44:44fancy boat and I feel bad cuz I want to
44:46buy that for you. But like, what are you
44:49going to do? Just reject him because he
44:51has that part of him that feels
44:52insecure?
44:57>> No, of course not.
44:58>> Of course not.
45:01Do you see? You're being given the
45:04foundation for the mastery of
45:07relationships. You're being given the
45:09greatest obstacle, which is our own like
45:12self-rejection.
45:13You've just bought into it and and
45:16compounded it. And now it's like, "Oh,
45:19oh my god, it's actually really [ __ ]
45:21adorable. There's a part of me that just
45:23feels unlovable. There's a part of me
45:25that actually feels beyond unlovable,
45:27not even seen.
45:30What a great opportunity for me to make
45:32space for that. for me to see that part
45:34of me, for me to recognize that part of
45:36the human conditioning is to feel that
45:39sense of inadequacy and insecurity. I
45:41guarantee you right now, Joe, there are
45:43people with tears in their eyes because
45:45they're recognizing that same part in
45:47them. You're already already making
45:50relationships with people you probably
45:52will never meet because you're helping
45:54them to find that form of relationship
45:56with themselves as we speak.
46:00>> Yeah,
46:01>> that's pretty cool.
46:03Yeah.
46:05>> How does that feel now?
46:08>> I guess I'm I'm thinking back to
46:12when it happened and what there was a
46:15moment where it kind of all just
46:16disappeared really quickly.
46:19>> Um and it was it was the word shame
46:23and it was like I was so ashamed of my
46:26experience that I wasn't letting it
46:28happen.
46:29>> Yeah. I guess cuz I don't know where
46:31that shame comes from. I don't know why
46:33it shows up.
46:36I don't know how to then include it.
46:39Maybe I don't need to know where it
46:40comes from. It's just sometimes people
46:43feel ashamed about how they feel. So
46:47give it the finger and don't even let it
46:50arise in the first place.
46:52>> Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,
46:53wait, wait, wait, wait. Do we like your
46:55daughter comes home, she feels shame
46:57because she'd messed up the exercise.
47:00She the friends of hers made fun of her
47:02painting, you know, because they were
47:05doing a painting class and all her
47:06friends laughed at her and she came home
47:08to mom with shame. Do you give her the
47:10finger?
47:11>> Definitely not. No,
47:13>> no, [snorts] definitely not. So, do you
47:14see you just did it again? Shame is the
47:18experience of that young girl who feels
47:20so embarrassed that all her friends are
47:22being picked and she's not. That's
47:24that's a horrific feeling.
47:27>> It's not the shame of that. It's the
47:29shame of that I feel
47:33>> that it affects me.
47:35>> Oh, okay. Right. Okay. Get it. Yeah.
47:37Which is two sides of the same coin. So,
47:38the shame that you're you're human
47:42>> and that that you don't want to feel
47:43bad,
47:44>> but then do you see how preposterous
47:46that is, too?
47:48>> Yeah. Kind of. I'm getting there.
47:51>> Yeah. Do you want to give your finger to
47:54that part of you that is feeling a bit
47:56embarrassed that you won't make space
47:57for the part of you that feels rejected?
48:00Or can you see that's another part of
48:02just being human?
48:08>> Yeah, I'll try. Yeah.
48:11>> Well, I get it. I want to be with you.
48:12It's not a try thing. It's a do or you
48:14don't.
48:15>> Yeah.
48:16>> Do you have a problem with the fact that
48:17you have two arms?
48:21>> Why not?
48:24They're really handy. I use them a lot
48:26and they came with a baggage. [laughter]
48:29>> No pun intended. They're very handy.
48:31>> Oh, I didn't see that.
48:34>> They're very useful. Yeah,
48:36>> they're useful because they allow you to
48:38do things, right? They give you like
48:40mobility and Yeah. So now apply the same
48:44distinction or perview on the part of
48:47you that feels rejected.
48:51That could be handy for what reason?
48:55What would be handy for a human being,
48:58particularly a woman who has aspirations
48:59to be a mother, to have a part of her
49:01that feels sometimes rejected or not
49:03chosen?
49:06>> I'm thinking now it's more
49:08it's the thing on top of that. It's the
49:12letting something affect me. That's what
49:14I'm not allowing.
49:16Or is that the same thing?
49:18>> It's well, it's part of the same
49:20mechanism. But just listen to what you
49:22said.
49:25You want to be in a relationship. Yes.
49:28And I'm going to assert part of being in
49:30a relationship are all the things that
49:31come with it. Love, being inspired,
49:34being moved, being touched,
49:38right?
49:39creating memories.
49:41I would say all of those belong in the
49:43bucket of allowing life to affect you.
49:46[laughter]
49:49>> Yeah. Okay.
49:53And I guess when I was young, I didn't
49:57every time it happened in school, I
50:00didn't let it affect me. So, it just
50:01built up.
50:02>> Yeah. It's just accumulated over time,
50:04which is why it feels a little bit
50:06overwhelming or intense, that's all.
50:08Yeah.
50:09>> You know, think again of your girl, your
50:11little daughter is coming home wanting
50:12to show you a picture or whatever she
50:14did at school and you keep ignoring her.
50:16One of two things is going to happen.
50:18Short term, it's going to escalate,
50:20right? She's going to probably get
50:21louder, more consistent, scream more, do
50:23whatever it is to get and then then she
50:25might become apathetic and quit. That's
50:27the dying part. It's like what's the
50:29point?
50:32So, you've got both sort of still at
50:34play. There's that voice in you that is
50:36desperate for you to include it, to
50:38allow it, to love it, to accept it, to
50:40recognize it's part of your humanity.
50:46Okay. Yeah. It's getting all muddled in
50:50my head, but it's like I was ashamed to
50:54feel shame.
50:55>> Yeah.
50:55>> To feel. I was ashamed to feel shame to
50:58feel.
51:00[snorts]
51:00>> Yeah. And it's why people get anxious
51:02about being anxious. [laughter]
51:04It's like the thing, the trigger, but
51:06then
51:07>> the the reaction.
51:09>> Yeah.
51:09>> Like I'm not allowed to react.
51:12>> Yeah. Which is asinine when you look at
51:15it as you are a human who is a sentient
51:18being who has no choice but to react
51:20whether it's expressed or not.
51:22Internally you're going to react.
51:27So what you're saying is I'm human but
51:28I'm not allowed to be human. Okay. Good
51:30luck.
51:31>> Have fun with that.
51:33Do you see how preposterous that is?
51:35>> I do.
51:36>> And [snorts] then you want to be in a
51:37relationship with another human. It's
51:39like, okay, that's going to go really
51:40well. [laughter]
51:41>> Yeah.
51:43>> Yeah. We've got to feel.
51:46>> Yeah.
51:49Like I don't know many people who feel
51:51to the depths that I feel. And I love
51:53that about me because I make space for
51:55it.
51:56I don't know many people who care as
51:58much as I care. And that's not in any
52:00way to dismiss people's capacity to
52:02care. There's some incredibly caring
52:03people out there, but most people are
52:05caring through the lens of survival.
52:06It's not sort of the absence of the
52:09ability to care, but it's just sort of
52:11right now prioritized towards their own
52:14selfish needs, which I totally get. But
52:16real care is when you've you've
52:18addressed your own needs. You've
52:19integrated them. You've allowed them.
52:21Now I can really show up and be present
52:23in relationships. That's why I'm saying
52:25you couldn't even have a relationship
52:27because you're not even allowing space
52:28for your own experience.
52:31Okay. [laughter]
52:38>> And here's the beauty, Joe. You become
52:40such a more attractive woman, human, and
52:44girlfriend, partner, wife, when you make
52:47space for all of you.
52:55Isn't that nice?
53:01Yeah, I I can't imagine
53:06I can't imagine going to work or just
53:09being around the house in my day-to-day
53:11life just feeling everything I feel
53:13like. It's kind of frowned upon to maybe
53:16it's a British thing, I don't know. But
53:20like it's a bit much, isn't it? To
53:24to feel things really intensely all the
53:27time. like it's
53:28>> well, we don't know cuz you've never
53:29done it.
53:31>> Okay.
53:32>> And here's my assertion. Yeah, the first
53:35few days, maybe the first couple of
53:36weeks, it might seem intense, but then
53:39it's going to normalize. It's just
53:41accumulated.
53:45You know, it's like saying it's frowned
53:46upon to like, you know, do laundry or
53:48show your dirty laundry in the house. So
53:50you just keep show, you know, shoving it
53:52in a cupboard somewhere and you got
53:54three decades worth of dirty laundry.
53:58You could definitely [laughter] argue
54:02>> Yeah,
54:03>> right. You could then argue, yeah, well
54:05[ __ ] it's What if I just bring all my
54:07laundry out? Well, yeah, you got three
54:08decades. It's going to be a little
54:10uncomfortable to begin with.
54:13>> But give it a couple of weeks and you've
54:14worked through it. Now you're like a
54:16normal person. You got one basket.
54:17That's manageable. Do you see? Same with
54:20your emotions and your feelings. Yeah,
54:22there's a backlog, but it doesn't work
54:23like that emotionally and and
54:26intellectually as it does with the
54:27material world. Meaning, yeah, you might
54:30have a few more days where you're a
54:31little bit more emotional, you have more
54:33depth, but it it it transpires very
54:36quickly on that level.
54:40>> Okay.
54:41>> Do you see that?
54:43>> Yeah. I'll uh I'll give it a go.
54:46[laughter]
54:48>> Yeah. Yeah.
54:48>> Watch out world.
54:49>> Watch out world. Joe just decided to
54:51show up and actually be human. God
54:54forbid.
54:55>> Yeah.
54:56>> So what I hear in the background is yes,
54:58maybe okay that you don't necessarily
54:59have these recollections of a bad
55:01childhood or that when your brother was
55:03born a year later that you suddenly were
55:05pushed aside, but maybe you did, you
55:07know, were raised in a family where, as
55:11is often the case, kids that have been
55:12seen and not heard. So you learned to
55:14suppress yourself a little bit. And that
55:16is partly British. I know I was a very
55:17good boy growing up.
55:24So another story to look at, my dear,
55:26might be you're not free to be you.
55:30Can you see that?
55:33That could be another context. Joe's not
55:35free to be her.
55:40>> I get really angry.
55:42Yeah,
55:44as you should. Because that's complete
55:46suppression. That's tyranny.
55:56[snorts] What's it like walking around
55:58feeling, believing that you're not free
55:59to be you?
56:06>> Like there's me and there's the wall.
56:09>> Yeah. It's like it's just heavy and
56:13there's nowhere to go. Suffocating.
56:16>> Yeah.
56:16>> Suffocating.
56:18>> Yeah. Well, this feels like maybe the
56:21big catch all that hasn't been
56:22expressed.
56:24Here you are. Is Is it possible for you
56:28to not be you?
56:33>> No.
56:34>> I try but Yeah. No.
56:35>> Yeah. You try, but you can't cuz you're
56:36there. I can see you. I can hear you and
56:38everyone around you can, you know,
56:40definitely feel your presence and hold
56:43you, right? You you you exist and then
56:45the story you live in is yes, I exist,
56:47but I'm not allowed to.
56:51[snorts]
56:52>> That would piss off anyone.
56:54>> Yeah.
56:58>> Yeah, I see that. I feel that.
57:01>> Yeah.
57:03And that would help to reinforce what
57:04we've just been talking about, right? is
57:06that you're not allowed to have your
57:07feelings.
57:10You can't be seen. You can't be
57:12recognized. So again, this makes even
57:13more sense energetically with
57:15relationships is you don't even allow
57:17yourself to be seen. Then why would
57:19anyone else see you?
57:21You don't allow yourself to be. So why
57:23would anyone want to be with you?
57:31And they do time and time again. And I
57:34I don't let it.
57:36>> No, of course you can't
57:37>> get angry at them. [laughter]
57:38It's not their fault.
57:40>> Yeah, I see that. I see the pattern.
57:42>> Yeah, that's all it is. This is all
57:44we're talking about in all of my work is
57:46we're just revealing patterns,
57:47conditioning, and code.
57:49>> You're living in a in a story that you
57:52feeling
57:53>> inadequate, not considered, not seen,
57:56shouldn't be there. You shut it down.
57:58You flip the bird to it. You take it out
58:00to the countryside with loud podcasts.
58:02not realizing that's just part of your
58:04humanity. [laughter]
58:05You start to see how preposterous it is,
58:07right?
58:09>> It's a great image.
58:11>> Yeah. [laughter]
58:12>> I had to get petrol a lot.
58:16>> So, not only you denying your own
58:18experience of being human, you're you're
58:20wasting a lot of money on gas.
58:22[laughter]
58:22>> Yeah.
58:25>> A lot of your content is free. So, thank
58:27you to buy [laughter]
58:30>> soothing podcast.
58:31>> Yeah. Yeah, it's funny.
58:34>> So, not only now do you get to have all
58:35your feelings, you're going to have a
58:36bit more cash cuz you're not [laughter]
58:38wasting burning, you know, gasoline
58:40driving around the countryside. Yeah.
58:43[laughter]
58:44It's a win-win. And all of it sits in
58:47the bigger container, which is Joe can't
58:49be Joe. [snorts]
58:51Good luck with that one.
58:54It's crazy
58:56to come full circle to think that I
58:59remember thinking I wish I wish my one
59:02of my parents
59:04had sat me down at that point and said,
59:06"By the way, we've never told you this,
59:08but when you were five, someone
59:11kidnapped you and held you at gunpoint
59:13or something really dramatic so that I
59:16could be like, "Oh, now I get why all
59:19this stuff happened so intensely."
59:22>> Yeah. And I don't I don't have that
59:26reference point of where I became so
59:28afraid of my own mind that I just run.
59:30>> Not literally, but
59:32>> I have to have noise.
59:34>> Yeah.
59:35>> To escape my own mind.
59:37>> Yeah.
59:38>> It's like there's nowhere to go.
59:42>> Precisely. Which is why you're learning
59:44the most powerful tool any human being
59:46can learn, which is presence and love.
59:50>> [ __ ] Yeah.
59:52>> [ __ ] [laughter]
59:55>> Yeah, I don't want to do that.
59:57>> Okay. Well, good luck with the rest of
59:59your life running away from yourself.
1:00:01Let me know how that works out.
1:00:08You see how preposterous it is, right?
1:00:10Like you're literally trying to get away
1:00:11from the you that you are
1:00:14with all of its conditioning and all of
1:00:16its beauty and all of its kindness and
1:00:18all of its neuro neurosis. And that's
1:00:20the humanity. That's the beauty. That is
1:00:23self-love. It's making space for all of
1:00:25it. Like I don't I've never met anyone
1:00:27with that tattoo. Exactly.
1:00:30You've literally declared it through ink
1:00:32on your own skin. Now you get to step
1:00:36into that energy.
1:00:40I've never thought of making space for
1:00:42shame. I thought it was
1:00:45hurt and anger and rejection, but
1:00:49shame I never thought I would have to
1:00:51make space for
1:00:53>> just
1:00:54>> or was something that I wasn't making
1:00:55space for.
1:00:56>> Hurt and anger, the byproducts of the
1:00:58shame that we feel. There are people out
1:01:00now listening who are hiding in their
1:01:03car, in their office, in their cubicle,
1:01:05on a bus, on a train, listening to this,
1:01:08who are hurt because of the shame they
1:01:10feel. like they might be sitting on an
1:01:12airplane right now and they're they're
1:01:14shameful because they've got an eating
1:01:15disorder and they think the person next
1:01:17to them looks at them as they're too
1:01:18skinny or they look like an addict or
1:01:20the opposite. They feel like they're too
1:01:22heavy and part of their body is leaning,
1:01:24you know, they're trying to keep their
1:01:26belly away from the other person's
1:01:28armrest or you know, it's part of the
1:01:31human condition.
1:01:33The shame that somebody knows that
1:01:35they're cheating on their spouse right
1:01:36now and they don't have the courage to
1:01:38share with them.
1:01:42It's everywhere.
1:01:46>> Yeah.
1:01:47>> And you have the opportunity right now
1:01:49and as part of your conditioning to make
1:01:52space for that.
1:01:54And here's the beauty. When you make
1:01:55space for your own humanity, including
1:01:57the parts of you that feel shame, that
1:02:00shame starts to dissipate.
1:02:04Yeah,
1:02:08it's quite beautiful.
1:02:11>> Yeah. Okay.
1:02:14[clears throat and snorts]
1:02:14>> So, do we know that Joe's going to spend
1:02:16the rest of her life by herself?
1:02:19>> No.
1:02:22>> Do we think there might be an even
1:02:23better chance now after this
1:02:25conversation that she's more likely to
1:02:27spend her life with somebody who can
1:02:29also love her to the degree that she
1:02:30loves herself?
1:02:34Yeah,
1:02:36>> I'd say that's a pretty good turnaround.
1:02:42>> Yeah, thanks.
1:02:44>> Thank you. You're a sweetheart.
1:02:46And again, nothing against your friends.
1:02:48I'm glad that they have their partners.
1:02:49But do we also know that just because
1:02:51they've got partners or even girls
1:02:53hitting on them that the rest of their
1:02:54life is just like [ __ ] hunky dory?
1:02:58>> No.
1:02:59>> No, we don't know that at all.
1:03:01They might be coming to you in 5 years.
1:03:03You're happily married. You're nursing
1:03:05with your beautiful second baby and
1:03:07they're going through divorce. They're
1:03:09devastated and they've become, you know,
1:03:10addicted to some sort of pain meds.
1:03:16You never know.
1:03:19So, I wouldn't use other people's lives
1:03:21as an excuse as to why they've got it
1:03:23all together and you haven't. That's
1:03:25just the way that the brain is using
1:03:27external examples to justify your own
1:03:31perspective.
1:03:35So my invitation to you is just as
1:03:37you're learning to allow all parts of
1:03:39you to be there, just allow life to be
1:03:41there. I don't know what I don't know
1:03:42what it means. I don't know where it's
1:03:43going to go, but I allow it to be.
1:03:45That's real peace.
1:03:51>> Sound good?
1:03:52>> Yeah, sounds good.
1:03:56Such a joy to be with you, Joe. I hope
1:03:57you get to find the same level of true
1:04:01pleasure it is to be with yourself as
1:04:03others feel when they're with you.
1:04:07>> Thank you. Yeah, you're going to be an
1:04:09extraordinary mom and you've been gifted
1:04:11the great conditioning to develop that
1:04:13level of love, compassion, acceptance of
1:04:15your own conditioning that will be the
1:04:17precursor to you being an extraordinary
1:04:19mother for somebody or somebody's.
1:04:24>> Thank you.
1:04:25>> It can all fit in that little beautiful
1:04:27cup on your wrist. Okay.
1:04:29>> Yeah.
1:04:29>> Make space for all of it.
1:04:33>> Thanks for your time. Appreciate it.
1:04:35>> Of course. It's really good to be with
1:04:37you.