Reels Expert: I Made $2M With One Video (Steal This Viral Hook!)

0:00Today's guest has mastered the art of

0:02short form content.

0:03>> Not to flex, but I'm pretty [ __ ] good

0:05at social media marketing.

0:06>> Always ahead for her age. She bought her

0:08first real estate property at 15 years

0:09old, got married at 16, and now at 20,

0:12is generating millions of dollars a year

0:14on Instagram. So, Ava, you just turned

0:1720. How much money did you make last

0:18month?

0:19>> 700K.

0:21>> In this episode, we'll break down her

0:22secrets to achieving consistent virality

0:24on social media.

0:25>> Step one, I would go to the Instagram

0:27explore page, type in my niche. I would

0:29say like a hundred videos over a million

0:32views.

0:32>> Unveil the blueprint for becoming the

0:34dominant voice in any niche.

0:35>> Step two, take the hooks from those

0:37videos and I would write 30 scripts with

0:39those viral hooks, but my own niche

0:41expertise

0:42>> and explore the viral secrets top

0:44creators don't want you to know.

0:46>> Step three, I would

0:47>> Jurgens, welcome to the Jack Neil

0:49podcast.

0:50>> Happy to be here.

0:51>> Awesome. Yeah, Ava just came in uh from

0:54Las Vegas. She was at acquisition.com

0:58workshop with uh Alex and Leila

1:00Hermoszi. So yeah, pretty cool to have

1:02you here. I've was just telling you

1:04before, I've been a big fan of her

1:05content for a while. I think the advice

1:07she gives on Instagram is super

1:09pertinent for short form content and

1:11just seeing her growth. I mean, how many

1:13followers have you gained in the past

1:15like two years?

1:17>> Um my business Instagram is 2 years old,

1:20so it's like 0 to 500K on that

1:22Instagram. and she also has really uh

1:25good business model that's generated her

1:27a lot and she's 20 years old which is

1:30very rare to be making uh this kind of

1:32money at 20 but we'll get into that. Um

1:34so Ava what's the most amount of money

1:37you've made from an Instagram reel.

1:40>> Um

1:42basically how it works just the funnel

1:44to explain it. if someone watches a

1:48video and at the end of the video I'm

1:49like, "Hey, comment xyz and I will send

1:52you information about my service." So,

1:55we had one of our videos where we

1:56basically explained how to grow an

1:58Instagram from scratch and it got 7.9

2:02million views, 13,000 like leads. And if

2:07people sign up with me, I do like a

2:10monthly reoccurring done for you

2:11service. They're paying anywhere from

2:132,000 to 4,000 a month to work with me.

2:17So, we got a lot of clients. Obviously,

2:19not all 13,000 of those comments

2:21converted, but we got a lot of clients

2:23and I want to say like 2 million in

2:25annual revenue from that one video.

2:28>> Got it. So, you got roughly how many

2:30clients from that video? It was about

2:32100, 200.

2:33>> Uh, I want to say 100 something. But,

2:36yeah, they basically turn into

2:38reoccurring revenue clients annually.

2:40That'd be 2 million.

2:41>> Interesting. So that one video, when was

2:43that posted?

2:44>> August of 24.

2:46>> August 24. Okay. So almost a year ago.

2:49And

2:51wow. So from that first video, how long

2:54had you been doing Instagram? Uh like

2:56that new brand up until that point. Was

2:58that just a few months in?

2:59>> Yeah. Oh, that was like a year in. I was

3:03sitting around probably like 100k

3:05followers, but that probably bought

3:07brought in also like 200k followers and

3:09a ton of leads. So that like really

3:12really took off. Um the Instagram and

3:14the business.

3:15>> Now how many clients would you say you

3:17service with the business?

3:19>> Yeah, we service around to say

3:23350 to 400.

3:25>> Interesting. Okay. And then what do you

3:27do for each of those people?

3:29>> Yeah. So for the done for you service,

3:32basically we spend like 10 to 12 hours

3:34every single month researching the top

3:37performing short form content in that

3:39client's niche. And we only work with

3:41business owners. And then we take that

3:43research and they have to fill out like

3:45onboarding documents in the beginning.

3:48And we create viral scripts out of like

3:50the viral hooks we researched, the

3:52topics that clearly work. And then we

3:54just make the value of the video kind of

3:56specific to them, what they teach, and

3:58everything. and then they film the

4:00videos, we'll take them back, we'll edit

4:02them, and then we post them for the

4:04client. So, it's like a monthly service

4:06where we're either making 15, 20, or 30

4:09reels for them. And it's like primarily

4:12Instagram reels, but we'll also

4:14repurpose on like Tik Tok, YouTube

4:16shorts, all the short form platforms.

4:18>> So, essentially, one video converted to

4:21about $2 million a year in revenue. Um,

4:23yes. And then from there, you've kind of

4:25just been maintaining and growing that

4:28amount of clients and trying to scale

4:30your systems to service as many people

4:32as possible. Like how many people would

4:34you say are on your waiting list that

4:36like you can't service but like you have

4:38leads for?

4:39>> Uh, we actually don't have a waiting

4:40list. I'm like we have a ton of SOPs. So

4:44when we hire someone, we're able to

4:45onboard really quickly.

4:47>> But yeah, we basically just have a ton

4:49of SOPs. So, it's not like something

4:51that we have to build out a weight list

4:52for, but we are pretty selective. I

4:54would say we're more selective now than

4:56before of just like what niches we work

4:58with. Um, just to make sure they're all

5:00like very solid ones that have grown on

5:03social before. So, like personal

5:04trainers, dog trainers, or just like any

5:07niche that has kind of case studies or

5:09social proof that we've already done or

5:11just like on social media already that

5:13we know can grow.

5:14>> It's just fascinating. I I just don't

5:15understand how you can scale to that

5:18many people and maintain quality. Um but

5:21it's obvious that you have because these

5:22people stay on recurring revenue. Like

5:24how do you how many employees do you

5:26have?

5:27>> A lot. So we have a mix of 1099

5:30contractors and W2. So it's over 100

5:33right now.

5:34>> Jesus Christ.

5:35>> So it's a lot of people.

5:37>> 100 people. Oh my gosh. Um Okay. And

5:40then did you when you first started the

5:42business, were you like how many

5:44employees did you have before that video

5:45took off? Like were you kind of

5:47scrambling to just fulfill as many

5:49people as possible?

5:51>> It I would say we had like 30, but we

5:53were like pretty comfortable then. But

5:56then once that video came out, we had to

5:58hire really quickly. But I will say with

6:00any agency, like you have to learn to

6:04keep quality up at that scale. like it's

6:07definitely been a learning curve and

6:08I've definitely made mistakes but I've

6:11learned so much and I have obviously so

6:13many SOPs now, so many managers in

6:15place, uh just so many I guess points to

6:18check quality. But yeah, a lot of

6:20quality control has been implemented and

6:22a lot of just extra positions just to

6:24make sure it stays the same because it

6:26can get bad really quick if you're not

6:28careful.

6:29>> Yeah, it seems like you're more focused

6:30on maintaining the clients that you have

6:33than trying to get new ones. Is that the

6:34case?

6:35>> Yes. Uh yeah, for sure now. That's where

6:37I'm at. Uh just trying to retain them as

6:40best as possible, get them the best

6:41results. Um obviously I want to grow, of

6:44course, but it's you got to care more

6:46about the clients you have than the

6:47clients you can get.

6:48>> Okay. So Ava, you just turned 20. What

6:51was it? Two months ago, 3 months ago.

6:53>> Uh March, like end of March. So two

6:56three months. Yeah.

6:57>> How much money did you make last month?

6:59>> I want to say 700K.

7:05Oh my god. I'm sorry. It It just throws

7:07me off every time people like say these

7:09numbers. You made $700,000 last month.

7:11And then are do are your expenses high

7:13for your business?

7:14>> Um I want to say they're a little bit

7:17under 50% of revenue. So yeah, I mean

7:23that's pretty average for an agency.

7:25>> Yeah. So you're making $700,000 a month

7:27at 20 years old, which is ridiculous. Uh

7:30is like when did this kind of journey

7:32start for you? I'd love to just kind of

7:34know like the um what were you like in

7:36high school? What were you like in

7:37middle school? Have you always been a

7:38scrappy entrepreneur? Um like how did

7:41you find success at a young age?

7:43>> Yeah. Um I'm so different from when I

7:46was 14, but uh originally like going

7:50into high school, all I kind of cared

7:52about was like my friends. I had

7:54straight A's. Like I was a good student.

7:56I wanted to be successful, but I

7:58probably I didn't really think about

7:59being a business owner uh for when I was

8:02that age. But then um I don't remember

8:07or actually I do. So my social studies

8:10teacher when I was 15, he started

8:13talking about Andrew Carnegie and like

8:15him just being scrappy and starting his

8:18own company and being so successful

8:20after being like growing up so poor. He

8:23like it just was so inspirational. So, I

8:24just searched up on Google like how to

8:26be successful or something stupid. Uh,

8:28and like the best books to read to be

8:30successful. And then that's when Rich

8:31Dad Poor Dad popped up. So, then I was

8:3415. I didn't have my license. So, I made

8:36my sister drive me to Target after

8:37school and I got that book. Um, and then

8:41when we got home, my dad was home, which

8:43was super weird, but he had like a mask

8:45on and we were like crap. And he had CO.

8:47So, this was like right when the

8:49pandemic was starting, but we had to

8:51quarantine for a week. So, I was off of

8:52school and I read that book probably

8:55like 2 days in and I was dating um my

8:58boyfriend at the time. He was my

9:00boyfriend Ben and we I made him read it

9:03right away and then we were like, "Oh my

9:05god, like why wait until we're 18? Why

9:07don't we just start a real estate

9:08investing company now?" So, we did,

9:11which was so hard to do uh when we were

9:13teenagers, but we basically direct

9:16mailed. We cold called every day after

9:18school uh because we went the offmarket

9:20route trying to find properties to do

9:22like long-term rental investments. And

9:25eventually after 3 months of doing that

9:27every single day, we finally got someone

9:29to say yes. And we got a duplex in uh

9:34it's like right outside Milwaukee. And

9:37that was our first investment. And then

9:38we kind of did that all throughout of

9:40high school um where we got short-term

9:42rentals and long-term rentals. Um, but

9:45it was I always say this, but like real

9:47estate's pretty miserable

9:48>> because like you're talking to people on

9:50the phone who like you're trying to get

9:52them to like sell you their house.

9:54>> Yeah.

9:55>> And they like hate you obviously. Like

9:57you get called a vulture, you get

9:59screamed at and like it's just not fun.

10:01Um, but after high school, so I

10:03graduated after my junior year, I just

10:06went full-time into real estate and I

10:07started posting just short form content

10:09on social media about it and just being

10:11young in business and like as a teenager

10:13in real estate. And like within the

10:16first month, I got like 50,000 followers

10:18just from posting short form content.

10:20And then I just realized it was so much

10:21better than real estate. And I was like,

10:24"Wow, I could probably do this for other

10:26business owners." because building your

10:27personal brand back in 2022 when I

10:29graduated, that's when it's like really

10:31started kicking off and became like a

10:33like the term personal brand. So, I

10:36started doing that for other people and

10:38just cold outreaching with like my

10:41Instagram account um just to business

10:44owners I saw online and I got a few

10:46clients and I kind of started off just

10:48like editing for them uh just the shorts

10:51but then that eventually turned into me

10:53starting my business Instagram then

10:55building out the full done for you offer

10:57and that's like the only service I have

10:59now just dialed in on making that

11:00perfect but that is kind of how that all

11:03happened. Got it. So, let me back up a

11:06bit on the real estate. Where did you

11:07get the capital to kind of invest in

11:08these properties?

11:10>> So, Ben, he I forget where he I think it

11:14was just YouTube, like Ryan Pana on

11:16YouTube. If you're familiar with Ryan,

11:18>> he um posted a video about couch

11:20flipping where it's basically you find a

11:23couch on Facebook marketplace for pretty

11:25cheap. You buy it, you clean it up, you

11:27just take better pictures, and then you

11:29put it back out. And we were making like

11:31$3 to $500 just flipping couches on

11:34Facebook an hour, I would say. $300 to

11:37$500 an hour. But the only problem with

11:39that is like you have to wait for the

11:40couches to come on. But we did that the

11:43entire summer. Uh so we got like a good

11:46chunk of cash um that we were able to

11:48use cuz property properties outside of

11:51Milwaukee like they're not like a lot uh

11:54they're not what people are used to.

11:55They're anywhere from like 100 to 200k.

11:58Um, so you didn't you don't need a huge

12:00down payment. But in order to buy it,

12:02you have to like cosign if you're if you

12:04were our age because we were under 18,

12:06but there's like different ways you get

12:08creative. Co-signing or getting getting

12:10an LLC in like your parents or a

12:12guardian's name and then eventually

12:14getting that when you're 18. So,

12:16>> and were your parents involved in real

12:18estate like investments?

12:20>> No, they are not. Like I mean they have

12:22a house but not for investing.

12:24>> Got it. Do you mind me asking like what

12:26line of business are they in?

12:27>> Yeah. So, my mom was a teacher and then

12:30my dad, he uh W2 up until I was 10 and

12:34then he started his own company. It's

12:37pretty boring, but it makes money. So,

12:39it's basically uh he makes phase

12:41converters, which is like if you have a

12:44frozen yogurt shop and you want to plug

12:46your big frozen yogurt machines in like

12:49an outlet, it won't work because it

12:51needs so much power. Can't just plug it

12:52in a regular outlet. So you get a phase

12:54converter to get more power and then you

12:57can plug it in that and it will work. So

12:59that's basically what it is. But he

13:01makes like big electrical machines for

13:03like bigger businesses.

13:05>> Yeah. And then your boyfriend uh now

13:08husband Ben, you basically made a video

13:11when you were 14 saying that you were

13:13going to marry your current husband.

13:15>> Yeah. So

13:17I remember when I first saw Ben in the

13:19math hallway, I was like, "Wow, this is

13:22the most muscular hot dude I've ever

13:24seen. And we were like 14, so I was

13:27like, "Wow." Um, so two weeks later he

13:30was my boyfriend, of course. Just

13:32kidding. But yeah, uh, we hit it off

13:35right away. Um, thing with Ben is like

13:38he it was just never awkward. We were

13:41friends right away and he's like such a

13:42socially awkward guy. So it was weird

13:43that like he felt the same way. But

13:46yeah, Ben's my best friend.

13:47>> And then what was the video you made?

13:49>> Yes. So that was probably like a month

13:52into our relationship. I was just like I

13:56basically my mom recorded a video while

13:58my friends were over and I was like I'm

14:00going to marry Benjamin William Otto and

14:03we just had that play at our wedding.

14:05>> Play this at my wedding

14:06>> here. Play this at a wedding. This is me

14:09at 14 years old on December 8th on a

14:12Sunday um in 2019. And I'm telling you,

14:15I'm a freshman, by the way, and I'm

14:18telling you right now that we got

14:20married to Ben Otto.

14:21>> So, that video we got, that video was

14:24when I was 14, we got engaged at 16, and

14:26then married at 19. So, we just played

14:28that video at our wedding, but I posted

14:30that on social media, and I think that

14:32is probably my most viral video cuz it

14:34got 50 million on Instagram, like 60

14:38million on Tik Tok, and it got like in

14:41People magazine. We went on the news for

14:43it. Um, but yeah, it was pretty crazy.

14:47>> Interesting. And is is that the video

14:49that kind of got you into social media

14:51or did you post that just kind of

14:53randomly after you were making real

14:54estate related content?

14:56>> That video specifically was it was like

14:58me reacting to that video at my wedding.

15:01>> Reaction content does so well,

15:02especially in like real life situations

15:04like that. So, I think that is why that

15:06went viral. And like I don't edit my

15:09videos, but we got our wedding footage

15:11back in October and I was like I know

15:14this this is going to work. So I just

15:15edited it and I posted it after like 10

15:18minutes and it did.

15:19>> Was that the first viral piece of

15:21content you made or had you gone viral

15:22before?

15:23>> No, this is when my Instagram was

15:24already pretty built up. This was in

15:26like I want to say September or October.

15:28So pretty recent. But that was like

15:31probably my biggest video.

15:33>> Okay. So to get into some of the

15:34virality related stuff uh because you

15:38service 300 400 people on going viral

15:42consistently. What would you say is the

15:44number one mistake people make when

15:46trying to go viral social media?

15:48>> Yeah. So people just like

15:52sometimes I always like to say everyone

15:53thinks they're a great marketer. Um but

15:56they will just post videos that they

15:59come up with and kind of expect it to go

16:01viral. Um, and then eventually when it

16:04doesn't, they'll just give up. But the

16:06thing with content is there are so many

16:09case studies out there of people in your

16:11niche that have already gone viral. And

16:13what you can do is you can just search

16:15up your niche in the Instagram explore

16:16page and you can click accounts and you

16:18can find like the top 10 to 20 people in

16:21your account or like in your niche. You

16:23go to their accounts and you basically

16:25want to look for videos like we call

16:26them outlier videos, but it's basically

16:29videos that just get a significantly

16:31amount or like a how how should I word

16:35this?

16:35>> Like a higher amount of views than their

16:37average.

16:37>> Yes. So like I I do what's called the 5x

16:40rule. So I'm like, okay, if it gets 5x

16:41views and the accounts followers, that's

16:43like a viral video in my mind. So we'll

16:45add all of those to a spreadsheet from

16:47their page. And then we will write out

16:49like the hooks. We'll write out how many

16:51views it got, the topic of the video,

16:53like the format it was filmed in. Um,

16:55and we'll do that for like 10 to 20

16:57videos for each creator, um, for those

16:5910 to 20 creators. So, you're getting a

17:01list of like few hundred reels that are

17:03like the best performing in your niche.

17:05And then you just use the hooks and the

17:08topics from those videos in your own

17:10content, but make the value your

17:12expertise and like your actual

17:15actionable valuable advice. And that is

17:18what works. And even still like when

17:20you're starting a new account, you can

17:22do that. But the first little bit you

17:23just have to like push through and get

17:25through because it's a slow growth like

17:27when you are starting a new account, but

17:29if you stay consistent and you do that

17:30method, you will grow a lot faster than

17:32just trying to post whatever you want to

17:34do.

17:34>> And what have you learned about social

17:37media virality uh like in the past few

17:40months that maybe you didn't realize a

17:42year ago, two years ago? Like what

17:44what's been new or has everything kind

17:45of been the same for a while? I would

17:47say obviously content's always changing.

17:50Um, but I would say probably the

17:54importance of like the three main hooks.

17:57So there's like visual hooks, so what

17:59you see in the first 3 seconds. There's

18:02written hooks, what you read in the

18:04first 3 seconds of a video. And then

18:06there's the verbal hook, so what someone

18:07says in the first 3 seconds. So using

18:10all three hooks and optimizing those.

18:12And then also it's something we call

18:14formats. So, like if you look at short

18:16form content, subconsciously you don't

18:18realize it when you're scrolling, but if

18:19you intentionally scroll, you'll see

18:21some people use like a whiteboard. We

18:23call that whiteboard format where

18:24they're like like maybe revealing things

18:26under paper on a whiteboard. Or we have

18:29like talking back and forth format where

18:31like two people might be dressed or one

18:33person is dressed up as two different

18:34people and they're like doing a little

18:36skit talking back and forth. Or there's

18:38talking head where you're just talking

18:40straight to the camera or there's audio

18:42B-roll where there's like a trending

18:44audio and then there's text on the

18:46screen. Um, but there's a ton of

18:48different formats and what I love to do

18:51is if I ever get a viral video, I will

18:54just recreate it in different formats

18:56and it usually does very well.

18:58>> Which of those formats would you say is

19:00the most valuable? Like if you could

19:01only be really exceptional at one um,

19:04and you wanted to use it to grow your

19:06business, what would you say is the most

19:07valuable? I would say the people who can

19:10consistently go viral and have the best

19:12personal brands like do talking form

19:14because I would say like if you look at

19:17an audio B-roll video versus a talking

19:19form video, you always get more

19:21followers, um more likes, more

19:24engagement, more leads through talking

19:27form videos, even if they get less

19:29views. Um but I would say anyone who can

19:32go viral just talking to the camera,

19:34that's like the best. um because it's

19:37the least engaging. Um so if you can do

19:40well with it, that means like what

19:43you're saying is super valuable and

19:44people don't need like all the ADHD

19:46things to like stay on your video.

19:48>> Yeah, that's interesting. I see like

19:49this big emphasis on short form content

19:52particularly among business owners where

19:54they're like, "Oh, we need to have like

19:55the best edits like um and like the best

19:58graphics, etc." But does like does

20:01editing really go far in a video?

20:03>> No. I would say like if I had to rank

20:06things, I would say it's the hook,

20:09then the script,

20:12um then the format,

20:15um

20:17and then probably the editing.

20:19>> Interesting. Okay. And then of the

20:22hooks, you said, uh visual hook, written

20:25hook, auditory hook. Uh, I would say it

20:30used to be verbal, but now it's visual

20:31because I mean people have always

20:33listened to things on mute, but now like

20:36if you're scrolling, there's so many

20:38people doing so many things and like so

20:40many visual hooks. So, you have to have

20:41a good one too if you want to make

20:42people stop.

20:43>> And what goes into a good visual hook

20:45and like what really makes people stop

20:47scrolling on Instagram?

20:48>> Yeah. So, I would say there's a ton of

20:51different visual hooks and like some

20:52people think like, "Oh, I have to do

20:54something crazy." But you can literally

20:55it can just be like you sitting down in

20:57a chair, like just a motion or like what

21:00we do a lot for clients is like if we're

21:02doing like a personal trainer. This is

21:04how my client went from 150 to 130 lbs

21:08in XYZ time and like have actual like

21:10pictures of the client's before and

21:12after on the screen. Um, so that could

21:15be a visual hook. um or like a above

21:19angle. So it's like the camera's up here

21:20instead of just like right here. So it

21:22doesn't have to be that complicated, but

21:24we just usually um when we're scrolling,

21:26if we ever see a new one that follows

21:28the 5x rule, we'll just add it to our

21:29little sheet. But there's just a ton you

21:31can do.

21:32>> And for you specifically, because I

21:33would imagine when you do this type of

21:35service business, you can't teach

21:37someone all the factors that go into a

21:39video. Like you can give them the

21:40script, the research, maybe an idea of

21:42the format, visual hook, etc. But like,

21:45do you think about your clothes? Do you

21:47think about like your hairstyle? Do you

21:49think about like the tonality of your

21:51voice for certain things? Like how many

21:53factors and variables are at play?

21:56>> Yeah. Like I would say that's kind of

21:59the hardest part. Everyone like we kind

22:02of leave the tone and

22:05well we'll ask clients if they want like

22:06their scripts to be funnier, more

22:08professional, serious, like an

22:09authority, but

22:12tone and like how you dress. I mean,

22:14tone's important, but like how you dress

22:16um and stuff like that, like it's

22:18probably things we care about less. But

22:20when we give a client a script, we

22:22basically at the top we have like three

22:24different sections. It's like the notes

22:26section, which gives a breakdown of like

22:28what format it is and how to film that

22:29format. Then we have the script section

22:32and it's just we put the script in

22:34bullets. And how we have clients film is

22:36we're like look at a bullet and then say

22:39it to the camera and then look at the

22:42other bullet then say it to the camera

22:43and we'll cut out all the pauses and

22:45then we have the caption um which is

22:47just the caption we put on the

22:48platforms.

22:49>> And then the subtitles, how important

22:51are like good subtitles for videos?

22:54>> Um I mean I would say back in the day

22:57they were like more important but now

22:59like it just doesn't really matter. I

23:01feel like a lot of people are tired of

23:02like crazy stuff, but it's important to

23:05have captions because so many people

23:08listen. Like I think it's 80 to 90% of

23:10people listen to content on mute. So

23:12it's like you kind of have to have them.

23:13>> And there's also like the if you're on

23:15Facebook or Instagram, uh particularly a

23:18lot of people are international, so it's

23:19like easier for them to read English. Um

23:22also it's really interesting as far as

23:24like gaining followers. Like what's the

23:26most amount of followers you've gained

23:28from a video? It's probably that one

23:30video I was talking about earlier.

23:32I want to say we got

23:36100K from that video, which is insane.

23:38That's like that's one video out of two

23:41years worth of posts. So, it's not

23:42common, but you do get those outliers if

23:45you post over a really long time period.

23:47>> What kind of content do you have to make

23:49to get more followers, would you say?

23:51>> Yeah. So that video was like pure

23:54education, you know, how to start your

23:55Instagram, grow it from scratch, and

23:57like step by step value, like from the

24:00beginning up until the end. But that was

24:04like so so valuable.

24:08So I the typically the videos that like

24:11are funny or memes, those will get you

24:14views, but they're not going to get you

24:15followers. Like people like to follow

24:17people who give them value. That's what

24:19I've found the most. So very valuable

24:21educational videos. And that's why I

24:23feel like for Mosie, for example, he's

24:25grown so quick because all of his stuff

24:26is so tactical. It's so actionable even

24:29though it's kind of like more niche.

24:31Like he's not in like a Mr. Beast type

24:33of niche, obviously. So that's how you

24:36grow, especially when you're a business

24:38owner, just providing so much value. And

24:40then how do you feel about the uh like

24:43if I had to branch uh speaking content

24:46into some niches, it would be like

24:48motivational speaking content uh

24:51entertainment and then education. Like

24:53I've noticed that sometimes when I post

24:55more motivational content that will like

24:57grow in followers and then same with

24:59education like you mentioned uh but

25:01entertainment kind of like you said

25:03doesn't really gain that many followers.

25:05But how do you think about brand? Cuz

25:08it's called personal brand launch and

25:10it's kind of like you're helping people

25:11go viral, get more leads, but how do you

25:13think about like the brand portion of

25:15things?

25:16>> Yeah, that's a good question.

25:20This is one like I I don't know. I have

25:22like I think my perspective on brand has

25:26shifted a lot, especially that I've

25:28grown more. Like I'm a lot more

25:30protective about what I post now. Um,

25:35I think before like I was fine if I like

25:37post a funny post and stuff, but now I

25:39just like want to make sure everything

25:41is super valuable, but I think I kind of

25:45follow a similar ideology as Hermosi

25:47when it comes to that where it's like,

25:49have you ever heard him give the like

25:52flower bouquet analogy?

25:54>> No. It's basically like you have a

25:56bouquet of flowers and every single

25:58flower like kind of makes a certain like

26:02what I like to phrase it is like you

26:03have your main niche which is like it

26:05could be fitness and then you have like

26:07your subniches which is like

26:09weightlifting, cardio, um maybe it's

26:12like a fun one where it's like I don't

26:15know maybe you make like protein

26:16desserts or something and whenever like

26:19people think about you they just

26:21associate you with all these things. I

26:23think that's just kind of how I see a

26:25brand. When someone looks at someone or

26:27a company and they just associate it

26:29with certain things,

26:30>> I guess more tactfully with you, I see

26:33like all your videos are very colorful.

26:36Uh you usually wear like a comfy looking

26:39hoodie with comfy looking sweatpants. Um

26:42like

26:42>> the captions look as though they're

26:44handwritten or something. Uh or the

26:46subtitles. Um how do you think about

26:48like those things?

26:50>> Yeah. So, I mean, brand's all about

26:51consistency, and I think really with

26:53social media, as long as you show up as

26:56like you, you'll be just on brand all

26:58the time. So, like sweatuits, I have um

27:02a Nike sweatuit and probably 15

27:04different colors for summer and for

27:06winter, like each, so probably 30. I

27:09have sweatuits. I have a black sweatuit

27:11and like I have five versions of their

27:13black sweatsuit. I wear it so much. Um,

27:16but that is on brand for me because that

27:18is just me. Do you just like get really

27:20cold or is Milwaukee super cold?

27:22>> I'm cold all the time and I live in

27:23Wisconsin so wow I just said that

27:26totally like

27:27>> Wisconsin.

27:28>> Um but yeah, it's cold there all the

27:30time. But it's great. It's kind of like

27:34the weather here kind of reminded me of

27:35it. Like 70 while the UV is like 10.

27:37That's what we've been getting lately

27:38and it's been pretty nice.

27:40>> H interesting. So okay, just congruency

27:44in what you do dayto-day with what the

27:47social media looks like. Is there any

27:48part of your life that you don't kind of

27:50show on social media as much?

27:53>> Um, I mean, I I pretty much talk about

27:56most parts of my life, but I would say

27:58my relationship is probably like the

28:00least I talk about, but I still bring it

28:02up sometimes.

28:03>> And you were telling me that Ben also

28:05runs a business. Um, I'm just curious to

28:08hear about his business as well.

28:10>> Yeah. So, Ben started a lawn and

28:12landscape company when he was 13. Now,

28:15he also has no plowing for the winter.

28:17But yeah, he is kind of like the same

28:20deal. He gets like reoccurring mowing

28:23clients, so it's like a good reoccurring

28:25revenue. He has three crews that just go

28:29out and do the stuff and then he does

28:31like landscaping projects as well. So

28:33those can be like 10 to 25k jobs.

28:35>> And then what's kind of your guys's

28:37routine or like what does your daily

28:39routine look like? I've seen

28:40>> you wake up at 3:00 a.m. have this

28:43really insane discipline.

28:45>> Yeah. So, it's even worse now. For the

28:47past year, I've probably woken up at

28:49like 12 a.m. every day

28:51>> because I'm a psychopath. But, um

28:53>> 12 a.m.

28:54>> Yeah.

28:55>> So, I had so much work to get done

28:57before I came here. I woke up at 11:30

29:00yesterday.

29:01>> 11:30 p.m.

29:03>> That's when you woke up. So, you're

29:04pretty tired right now?

29:06>> No, I'm good. I'm used to this.

29:07>> Chilling. Okay.

29:08>> Yeah. So, basically, I will get up at

29:1112:00 a.m. I will work for about like 4

29:14to 5 hours and then I wake Ben up and

29:17then we go to the gym. Um, we do like

29:20we'll lift. Um, and then afterwards

29:23we'll come back and he gets ready and

29:25leaves for work cuz obviously a lot of

29:27his stuff's out on the field and he's

29:29not completely out of his business yet.

29:30Um, he still helps his landscaping crew

29:32a lot. So, he's pretty much gone um

29:35until two and then I'm home pretty much

29:38all day. Uh just I mean in the morning

29:41I'll do my deep work and then during the

29:42day I usually do a lot more admin tasks,

29:45management,

29:46um just kind of like what needs my

29:48attention at the moment cuz obviously

29:50when you're CEO your days never really

29:52look the same. You just go where you're

29:53needed. But then around three is usually

29:58like when I'll start winding down. Ben

30:00will come home. He might have some like

30:02quotes later on, but I will just

30:05literally rot the rest of the day. I

30:06will read a book. I will watch TV or

30:08I'll hang out with Ben. Um, just because

30:11I usually stop when I'm kind of like

30:12burnt for the day.

30:14>> So, why do you wake up at midnight every

30:16day?

30:17>> Um, honestly, I've just found like I've

30:20done a lot of different things and

30:21that's just what I found works for me.

30:23Even though it sounds psychotic, I'm so

30:25used to it because I've been waking up

30:27since like at least 3:00 a.m. since I

30:29was 15.

30:31um just to get and get the real estate

30:33stuff done before school or um at the

30:35time like when I first started I was

30:37like the type who would read all the

30:38books before getting started. So I'm

30:40used to getting up early. Um but it's

30:43just the one time of day where nobody

30:46bugs me. Not even Ben. Like he's still

30:48sleeping and I actually can just get

30:52everything done.

30:53>> And what does your deep work look like?

30:54Like the first four hours of your day.

30:56>> It's just whatever is going to grow the

30:57business the most. So it might be making

31:00SOPs. It might be making content for PBL

31:03like scripting. Um or it might be hiring

31:06like going through applications. It just

31:09depends on like what's going to grow the

31:10business the most at that moment.

31:12>> And like what do you not outsource? Like

31:14what are the things you do yourself? You

31:16said it's hiring SOPs. Like you actually

31:18go through and make the SOPs and you go

31:21through and hire every employee in the

31:22business. uh not as much anymore, but I

31:26would say with agencies in specific, if

31:30you don't use your agency, you have a

31:32problem. Like you need to use what you

31:36are trying to sell. So, a lot of that

31:38stuff, like we even have our clients

31:41like review their own scripts to make

31:42sure it's good. Like I'll still review

31:43my scripts and stuff, make sure that's

31:45good. Review like edits before they go

31:47out. But um I would say for now what I

31:51haven't outsourced yet is people

31:54creating the SOPs. Like I'm insane. It's

31:56like every single mouse click of a

31:58process I will have written down

32:01>> just so it's not messed up. And I have

32:03the written versions of every SOP and

32:05like also the video version of every SOP

32:08like doing the process. So I have always

32:12done that but I am in the process of

32:16hiring a director of operations just

32:18someone who can do that.

32:19>> And what have been the most important

32:21hires in your business that have like

32:23really scaled it?

32:24>> Yeah. So I think with agencies

32:27as I we were kind of talking about

32:28earlier quality when you scale an agency

32:33I think your success is based off of the

32:36talent you hire and a lot especially

32:39because this industry is pretty new like

32:41coming up in the past decade

32:43it's really hard to find good people so

32:46you just have to have good pay and a

32:49good team that's motivating each other

32:52but I would say like the most important

32:55part of having a successful agency

32:57that's good at scale is just hiring

32:59really good people with very niche skill

33:02sets. So like ideiation for example,

33:05that's something I'm hiring for right

33:06now

33:08and it's just something I've been trying

33:10for I think two months, but this is

33:12normal for these like niche roles. uh

33:14just putting out an application every

33:17single weekend to try and find someone

33:19and like you'll always eventually find

33:21someone. But you just it's all about

33:23volume and just getting enough

33:24applications and just finding that that

33:26one person.

33:27>> Is that ideation for your brand or for

33:29your clients?

33:30>> Clients cuz I do a lot of it right now

33:32and that's why I work so much.

33:34>> So you're coming up with the ideas. So

33:36you're looking at the outlers and then

33:38kind of coming up with an idea based off

33:40that or what do you mean?

33:42>> Yeah. We have like researchers who will

33:44research it and then I'll just review

33:46the client's onboarding document. I'll

33:48review the research and I'll kind of

33:51create ideas. So, I'll do like, okay,

33:54this is what I want the hook to be. This

33:55is what I want the value to look like of

33:57the video. Now, here's also the format I

34:00want. And then we'll give it to the

34:01copyriters.

34:03But it's super unsustainable like

34:05because we have so many clients. So,

34:07that's why I also kind of have to get

34:10up. Um, but we're definitely looking to

34:13get people, but I'm not going to let

34:15that go until I find someone who's like

34:17me.

34:17>> I would guess that a bottleneck you

34:18might have, and correct me if I'm wrong,

34:20is

34:20>> that was such a bottleneck.

34:21>> Uh, that the virality portion, like for

34:25your clients to get really good results,

34:27I I would guess that the scripts that

34:29have done really well or the videos that

34:30have done really well, you've had at

34:32least some involvement in those

34:34particular scripts and like you reviewed

34:35them or is that not the case?

34:37>> No, it is. Um because right now I'm in

34:40almost every script set like that we

34:42have that's going out. And like I think

34:45something as a business owner I've had

34:47to learn is like I mean I was out of the

34:49business for a while but then I saw

34:51results drop after I got out. So I had

34:53to go back in and now we have to hire.

34:55Like I just have to be more intentional

34:56with hiring. But because we're missing

34:58that person right now I'm still in every

35:01single day.

35:02>> So that's 30 scripts for each client a

35:04month.

35:04>> It's either 15 20 or 30.

35:07>> Okay. So 20 and then 400 clients. That's

35:12what 8,000 scripts a month.

35:14>> Yeah. It's like super unsustainable.

35:16>> And do you like go through all those?

35:18>> So basically for the ones I can't do

35:20ideations on, I review after they're

35:24done and I'll just make replacements if

35:25that's needed cuz like our copyriters

35:27are still like good at ideiation, but

35:29like obviously I've been doing it like

35:31the most I have the brand. So yeah, but

35:34if they have the hooks and they have the

35:36client, like they can still make great

35:37scripts and then you just make some

35:38adjustments after. But I have one other

35:41person on my team, Jane. I love her. Uh

35:44she's like the same skill set as me. Um

35:47and she helps a ton on the reviews and

35:49she's the only other person I trust to

35:52like do that without my review after.

35:55But both of us combined like we are both

35:58at our breaking point.

36:01>> Yeah. I mean, it sounds like a I what

36:03I'm impressed with with your business is

36:06that you haven't um gotten shiny object

36:08syndrome and been like, "Let me just

36:10drop a course. Let me drop something

36:11that everyone can buy a million times."

36:13And I'm sure you think about it every

36:14day when you're reviewing all these

36:15scripts, but like what's kind of kept

36:17you from doing that and like looking at

36:20other options?

36:21>> I know if I like I want to make this

36:24service like perfect before I ever do

36:26something else. like I want to make it.

36:28I just want to be the go-to short form

36:31content, you know, creation agency for

36:34business owners. And I just will not

36:37stop until that's the case. And that

36:38just means literally refining the

36:40product and making it better every

36:42single day. And until I feel like it's

36:44perfect, I probably won't do anything

36:46else. And I'm very like picky. Like

36:48yesterday I got

36:52it's kind of an odd situation but Adobe

36:56they like wanted to become part of like

36:57the editing part of the service

37:03but I just said no even though it was a

37:05lot of money and it I mean Adobe's great

37:08but I just like I don't want anyone to

37:10have any like control over it. Like I

37:12just want it to be mine and I just want

37:14to make it perfect, but I don't want

37:16like any other service or product I

37:19could make to like take my time away

37:21from doing that.

37:22>> So, what are you guys using to edit the

37:23content?

37:24>> Uh, we like

37:28uh Da Vinci, Premiere Pro. I mean, we

37:32use a mix of different ones, but like

37:34basically we have editors are are like

37:38our mo we have out of like all of our

37:401099s, editors are the most cuz like

37:43editing is so timeconuming and until AI

37:45can like fully do it, we still need a

37:47ton. And we just basically rank our

37:52editors like, okay, they can do basic

37:54edits, they can do medium edits, or they

37:55can do like really good ones. Um, and

37:58then whatever. Like we just have like a

38:01for we have a ton of different editing

38:02styles and when a client comes on with

38:04us, they can choose from like a bunch or

38:06they can find one off like on their own

38:09and then we'll just do it.

38:10>> What's the most common editing style

38:12people request? Is it like, oh, I want

38:14it to look like Iman Godzi or Alex

38:15Ramosi or

38:16>> uh it used to be Alex, but I think it

38:18kind of went out of style like his old

38:20old captions if you know what I'm

38:21talking about

38:22>> with the emojis and stuff. Yeah. Um, but

38:24now I would say a lot of people actually

38:26go for more simple captions like you

38:29know what Leela does where it's like

38:30kind of like on her on her talking head

38:32videos. She does just like does very

38:35simple captions and people like

38:36>> little light ones. Okay.

38:37>> Yeah. But we also have like a lot of

38:39other ones too um that people like that

38:42are more complex. But I wouldn't say

38:44it's like they're not like

38:47I can't think of anyone who like would

38:52like like it's not like a herozi style.

38:54It's not

38:56um one of the big ones, but they're just

38:58like kind of like their own customized

39:01ones that we get a lot as well. But

39:03yeah, they'll pick one of those and then

39:05we will get the we have like all the

39:07editing styles ranked and then we'll

39:09just give, you know, a basic edit to a

39:11basic editor. um and kind of like medium

39:15edit to medium editor and you get the

39:16idea. But we just have the editors use

39:20whatever they like and as long as it

39:22looks like the reference then it's fine.

39:24>> So for someone who maybe can't afford

39:27your service or like you couldn't work

39:29with them for whatever reason, what

39:32employees would they need to hire? What

39:33process would they need to do for

39:35growing their personal brand? Let's say

39:37they wanted to do just

39:39>> fitness educational content.

39:42Yeah. So, basically what I would do is

39:44obviously make your Instagram account.

39:47Um, but I would say the first thing is I

39:50explained the research method earlier.

39:52So, I would do that, but I would also do

39:54one other research method, which is you

39:56go on Instagram, go to the explore page,

39:58you hit the search bar, and then you

40:01just type in your niche. So, if it was

40:03like dog training, you just type in dog

40:05training. Or you could create like I

40:07like to create like five to 10 keywords

40:09that relate to that. And then once you

40:12search it, you click the reals tab. And

40:13I wish I could show you this visually,

40:15but then you will just come across

40:18literally like the most viral hooks in

40:21that niche. And if you like scroll on

40:24that reals tab after you do that keyword

40:26research, you want to look through all

40:28the videos that have over a million plus

40:30views and just save the hooks that you

40:31would use. And then typically what I do

40:33is I just make sure they follow the 5x

40:36rule and then I'll add them onto a

40:37spreadsheet. And then those are like

40:41I mean Instagram SEO kind of sucks but

40:43like

40:44>> it really does. Yeah.

40:45>> Yeah. I mean Tik Toks is really good

40:46compared to Instagram but I don't like

40:48to use Tik Tok as a reference cuz

40:50Instagram is harder to go viral on. So

40:52like I like to use Instagram for

40:54ideiation better. But yeah that's

40:57probably the research I would do along

40:59with like finding the top 10 to 20

41:01creators. And then after basically

41:04basically what I do for clients, I would

41:06just write probably a batch of like 15

41:09to 30 scripts with, you know, the viral

41:11hooks, the viral topics, but with your

41:13own, this is so important. You don't

41:15want to copy viral videos. That will

41:17just make you look like a fraud. So you

41:19want to add your own like value in the

41:21meat of the video. So your own

41:23actionable advice. So, like if you're a

41:25dog trainer, you want to show people how

41:27to teach their dog step by step how to

41:29sit or like I saw this one girl do like

41:32how I taught my dog to shut the door and

41:33I thought it was like the coolest thing

41:35and she gave you the stepby-step advice.

41:37I hate or I don't hate but like when

41:40people give like fluff, it just never

41:43works. I mean, it doesn't never work,

41:45but it just is a lot harder to go viral

41:48when you're giving fluff um than opposed

41:50to like actionable value that people can

41:52actually take away right away.

41:54So write scripts with your own expertise

41:56and experience um on how to get you know

41:59people XYZ result. Make 15 scripts um

42:02use different formats. Test everything

42:04out on your account. So if you are

42:06starting from scratch, I like to try a

42:07bunch of different topics, a bunch of

42:08different formats in your niche and then

42:11you post like 50 to 100 videos. Try and

42:14post every single day. And then

42:15basically after 50 to 100 videos on a

42:18new account, you can kind of see, okay,

42:20what worked better, what formats worked

42:22better, what hook hooks worked well,

42:24what topics worked well, and then you

42:26just start doubling down on, you know,

42:29those hooks, formats, and topics. And

42:31you just keep doing that over and over

42:32again, and you will grow over time.

42:35>> I want to ask about two things. The

42:36first is the fluff portion. Can you

42:38define what you see as fluff in most

42:41content? because this is something I

42:42have to help a lot of people with when

42:43they ask me for advice on their videos.

42:45But I'm not just cutting things that

42:47aren't valuable. I'm cutting things that

42:50aren't valuable and things that aren't

42:52interesting. Like both of those two

42:53things. But how do you think about it?

42:55>> When I think of like fluff,

42:58um, let's see. Like fluff to me and like

43:02I'm pretty picky. Like I like things to

43:04be really specific. But if I'm a

43:06personal trainer and I'm giving advice,

43:08I'm like, "Okay, walk every day, lift

43:11every day, eat healthy." But like

43:13actionable value would be walk 10k steps

43:16every single day. Do this exact 4day

43:19split. Um, and then like have them show

43:21the split. Um, or like for calories like

43:26use this tde calculator online. Subtract

43:292 to 300 calories. Uh, that's your

43:31calorie deficit. eat this every single

43:33day, eat one gram of protein per pound

43:35of body fat. Like it's very clear what

43:38they need to do and like they want to

43:40save that stuff cuz it's actually

43:41helpful. So it's like that's what I

43:45would say fluff versus real value is.

43:47>> Interesting. So just be as specific as

43:49possible and as helpful as possible. How

43:51about when you're telling like a story?

43:53Like if you were to tell us the story of

43:56>> how you did this at 20 years old. um

43:59like what do you consider fluff in that

44:01instance?

44:02>> So yeah, I like consider educational

44:05content and storytelling content

44:06completely different.

44:07>> Okay.

44:07>> But basically in our client scripts, if

44:09they have the 20 scripts package, we

44:12will have four storytelling scripts and

44:1416 educational.

44:16>> I think storytelling they do well, but

44:18like it's there's it gets it can get

44:22repetitive, so we don't like to do as

44:23much. But people love like my story

44:27videos or just like how they grew, like

44:30how they grew or their personal

44:31transformation. Yeah, people love that

44:33stuff. And I wouldn't consider like that

44:36stuff fluff if you're telling a story,

44:38but like educational content is where

44:40you see the fluff. But storytelling is

44:42completely different. Um, I think you

44:44can be a lot more like as long as you're

44:46vulnerable and you know there's a good

44:49payoff at the end of your story, it

44:50could do really well because it's

44:52definitely been more popular lately.

44:54>> If you could give us an example like

44:56what's a story you find yourself telling

44:58all the time like when you meet people

45:00like here's how I grew this business.

45:02>> It's the one I already told. It's like

45:04the

45:05>> cuz people always ask like oh how do you

45:06get into this? Um, so I would just tell

45:09them like, "Oh, I started in real

45:11estate, da da da da, posted content, did

45:13well, got into this."

45:16>> So, yeah.

45:17>> And why do you choose like those parts

45:18to include?

45:20>> Is there like any thought to that?

45:22>> I would say mainly because they're all

45:25just vital to telling the story. Like I

45:27got into real estate and because I saw

45:29all these other big real estate people

45:30like I want to start posting on social

45:32media. It did really well and I was

45:34like, "Wow, real estate sucks. this is

45:37fun. I'm gonna do this instead.

45:39>> Yeah, I did notice how you crafted the

45:41story. I was like, it's very interesting

45:42like the parts she left out, but it's

45:44the most crucial thing needed to

45:47understand it well. Um, another thing I

45:50wanted to ask you about with your

45:51clients. So, you do 15 to 30 videos for

45:54them a month. Do you ever think that if

45:57you did like a couple videos for them,

46:00like the more experienced one, if you

46:01just did like four really good videos,

46:03that would be better? And just like how

46:04do you think about quality versus

46:06quantity in general?

46:08>> Yeah, I think about that all the time.

46:11Um, I would say like

46:14I try to treat the 30 videos like I was

46:17doing four, if that makes sense. Like I

46:20don't like to give a client a script

46:21unless I feel proud of it

46:24and that makes it so much more time

46:27consuming. But I do think like if you

46:30really did just hone in on four, I think

46:32personally

46:34I wouldn't like that because you're not

46:36testing as much. You're not seeing what

46:37works as much. So I think it might

46:39actually be worse cuz if you can just

46:42test a bunch and then just study what

46:43works and then double down on that, like

46:45I think that's way better.

46:47>> And when do you ever like are there any

46:49videos that you put a significant amount

46:50of time into that it's been worth it or

46:52is it usually just not worth it? I would

46:55say a like every single one of my

46:57videos, there's so much time into it.

46:59But

47:01I think the videos I spend the most time

47:02are when I find like real life examples

47:05of the point I'm trying to make cuz like

47:07you have to go find the case studies and

47:10leave really good editing notes and

47:11stuff. But it always makes it worth it

47:14because people get the visual and they

47:16can actually see it and it's not just

47:17like words they're hearing. So I would

47:19say it's worth it.

47:20>> And then tell me about some of your

47:21clients uh that you've worked with. What

47:23have been like some crazy success

47:25stories? Does any I'm guessing this is

47:27the case, but do any of your clients

47:28make like significantly more money than

47:30you from the service?

47:32>> Yeah. So, there's one in particular. Um,

47:36there was this one I was nervous to take

47:38on. His name's Carl and he's like an

47:42older gentleman, probably like 65. He

47:45has like 10 kids, but that's not

47:47relevant. It's cool. But yeah, he is in

47:51the franchise niche. And the reason I

47:54was nervous was because I don't know

47:56anyone in the franchise niche. I tried

47:58to do research and like there wasn't

48:00really anyone. So, I was like skeptical,

48:01but I was like, "Okay, I'm just going

48:03to, you know, really really try on these

48:05and like I basically just researched

48:07other niches and try to convert it to

48:09his."

48:10>> And franchising is

48:12>> like he basically is a franchise broker.

48:14So he works with like a ton of popular

48:16franchises and then he works with

48:20clients and tries to get them or like

48:22suggests certain franchises that would

48:24work for them and if they start it he

48:25gets a commission.

48:26>> So like Wendy's Chick-fil-A or like what

48:28kind of franchises?

48:29>> Like those but not Chick-fil-A. They're

48:31like very like in-house kind of and very

48:33selective. But like I'm trying to think

48:36like Great Clips Molly Made. There are

48:39some restaurants but can't really think

48:42of off the top of my head. But then

48:44basically what we did is cuz he was

48:47starting from scratch too, but we looked

48:50at like a ton of different niches as I

48:51said, did research and then converted

48:53them over to his and we did like videos

48:55like

48:58or Burger King or um like Crispy Cream

49:01or Duncan and like just like those

49:03comparison videos I would say. Well, we

49:05posted like 3 months worth of content

49:08and we were like under 100 followers and

49:10I was like what the heck? but it's also

49:12just kind of part of having a new

49:14account. So then on our fourth a new

49:16account. So then on our fourth month we

49:18got our first viral video. I think like

49:209 million views and it was breaking down

49:24how much you make owning a McDonald's

49:26franchise I think. And we took that

49:30exact video script and format and then

49:32just replaced the restaurant in it and

49:36it just kept going viral and viral. So

49:38then we also

49:40um took that original viral video and we

49:43made it into an audio B-roll video and

49:45that one got like 10 million views. And

49:47we have just kind of started replicating

49:49that format and then like pinning to um

49:53different franchises against each other

49:55to show you what makes more money. And

49:56like those three things consistently go

49:58viral for him. So now that we have that,

50:01we just every single month script videos

50:03that are different versions of that with

50:05a CTA that leads to, you know, uh his

50:08like franchise broker stuff. So yeah,

50:11and he like basically makes like 60K for

50:14every single person he gets and he gets

50:17like hundreds of leads. So,

50:18>> and what does he do exactly? like he'll

50:21take someone and be like you'd be good

50:22for this franchise and

50:24>> broker the deal or

50:25>> so like his target audience is people

50:26who are in 9 to5 like manager positions

50:30and could just manage our own franchise.

50:32>> Do you know how much he's doing roughly?

50:33>> No, I don't. But I know like sometimes

50:36he'll just text me like, "Oh, we got

50:39five deals this week and that's like

50:43>> 300k." Yeah.

50:44>> Oh my gosh. Geez. Uh, and then has there

50:47have been any other success story that

50:48stands out to you like um of someone

50:50that took a while to grow?

50:53Um, I would honestly say, I mean, I have

50:56some that like grew really quick, some

50:58that took a while, but I would say

51:00another person that took a really long

51:01time was myself

51:03>> when I first started my Well, I

51:05originally I have like a personal

51:06account and then a business account and

51:08I started posting the social media stuff

51:10on my personal account and it just like

51:13wasn't aligned with my business content.

51:15So, it didn't do well. And you'll find

51:17that when you try to post a new niche on

51:19a profile you already built up

51:21surrounding a niche, it just doesn't

51:22work. Um, so

51:25I started a different business,

51:27Instagram, or personal brand launch, and

51:30I think 3 months it was the same thing,

51:32just like under 100 followers, posting

51:36every day. And then the fourth month, I

51:38got my first viral video. And same deal.

51:42It's just the same thing that happens

51:43every time when you make a new account.

51:44takes a while, but you'll eventually get

51:47your first viral video and then you just

51:49double down on that. That is how you

51:51grow a page.

51:51>> Is there anything ultra specific that

51:54feels like a hack on social media? Like

51:57anything with trial reels, anything

51:58you're doing with testing on TikTok?

52:01Like I know a lot of people do multiple

52:02pages for testing with different types

52:04of hooks, like a bunch of crazy stuff.

52:06But is there anything like that that

52:07you've looked at recently? I wouldn't

52:09say recently, but I think for a long

52:12time we were one of the not the first

52:14agency, but we were one of the I guess

52:17first short form agencies to really take

52:20research serious. Like we have always

52:22been doing like 10 to 12 hours of

52:24research a month to like every single

52:27month too. It's not like just the first

52:28month. And like we just do that

52:31religiously so we can study what works

52:33and we also just double down on what

52:34works and researching and doubling down

52:36on what works for that person. It just

52:39does wonders. That's like all you need

52:40to do.

52:41>> It's funny you say this. I mean I'll

52:43probably cut this out but maybe not. Um

52:45just like a lot of the secret sauce of

52:47why this podcast has done well is

52:49because I noticed I was like I asked all

52:51the other big podcasters because I kind

52:53of knew them. It's like how much

52:54research do you do like to craft the

52:57clips ahead of time? and they're like,

52:59"Oh, no. We don't even think of it like

53:00that." I'm like, "Oh, well, you can just

53:02find a guest." Like, let's say you went

53:04on another podcast, had a viral clip,

53:06just take the exact same hook and get

53:08them to retell the story differently. No

53:10one does that. Can you believe that? Um,

53:12it's been a major attribution to any

53:14views I've gotten on this podcast. But,

53:17um, I definitely agree with you that

53:18research

53:20>> goes a long way. And for for YouTube

53:22specifically, do you like I I I think

53:25YouTube and short form can be really

53:27similar, but people will find like

53:30outliers on like even smaller pages and

53:32then like use those titles and

53:34thumbnails. Do you ever do that?

53:36>> 100%.

53:36>> Yeah, I think that's so important.

53:38>> Definitely. Uh yeah, the thumbnail

53:40outliers is where this all started. Like

53:42view stats by Mr. Beast has been super

53:45helpful um for coming up with stuff. But

53:48>> is that like so on Instagram we have

53:50like something called sort feed

53:52>> and it's like it like will automatically

53:54sort someone's videos on their profile.

53:56Oh that's maybe my hack then.

53:57>> Yeah.

53:58>> So there's this thing it's called the

53:59sort feed extension. It used to be free.

54:02It's like it turned like $40 for like

54:04it's a lifetime. Like you'll get it for

54:06your life if you pay 40 bucks and it's

54:07so worth it. But if you go on someone's

54:09Instagram page and you click reels, you

54:12can click the little puzzle piece in the

54:13corner of your screen and you can

54:16basically select, you know, 100, 500,

54:18all of their reels and it will sort them

54:20from most to least viral.

54:22>> We use this. Yeah. Okay.

54:23>> Did you make a video about this?

54:24>> Yeah,

54:25>> that's why I use it for sure.

54:27>> I use it every day.

54:29>> Yeah, it's awesome. But is like that

54:32what view stats is for YouTube?

54:34>> View stats is a little more interesting.

54:37Um, but that tool is really helpful

54:39because no one has built anything for

54:41Instagram that can sort the videos. Uh,

54:43but and then Tik Tok recently came out

54:45with a thing where you can sort people's

54:47profiles by most liked or most viewed,

54:49etc. But view stats like you can search

54:53>> uh like a good example, I had this

54:56thumbnail um of a guy holding up a

54:59hoodie and it said $500 million a year

55:02um because like he has a brand called

55:04Comfort Clothing that makes 500 million

55:06a year. I have like literally seven

55:08other sweatsuits.

55:09>> That's interesting. I was wondering if

55:11you wore those because like Yeah. Um

55:12>> I wear Nike for like videos, but I have

55:15a ton of theirs.

55:15>> Yeah, comfort's nice. But um essentially

55:18we took that thumbnail and then post it

55:20on view stats and it will show other

55:22things of people holding up hoodies or

55:24holding up t-shirts with text on them.

55:26And then we kind of reorganized the

55:28thumbnails based on the outlers. Um or

55:31if you I don't know search certain

55:33keywords like body fat, it'll show all

55:35the outlers for body fat and then you

55:37can make it specific to a podcast. Um

55:40>> but yeah, I mean if I like I use it for

55:42short form content too because if you go

55:44on YouTube, find an outlier, you can

55:46kind of take that as a visual hook,

55:48>> you know what I mean?

55:49>> Yeah, I do that too actually. I'll find

55:51like those on YouTube where they have

55:53like obviously they went very viral for

55:55like a small account and we will use

55:57like their thumbnails can be really

55:58great visual hooks or like their titles

56:01can be good verbal hooks or written

56:02hooks.

56:03>> H how important is the thumbnail for

56:05Instagram?

56:05>> Not important. I mean like yeah people

56:08might see it on the explore page and

56:09click it but like I have never like

56:12intentionally made a thumbnail in my

56:13life.

56:13>> And then so you're 20, you make $700,000

56:16a month. How do you invest this money?

56:20Yeah, I invest it into index funds.

56:24>> Boring answers of the best. Um, index

56:27funds. Gotcha. Just and that's it.

56:29Nothing else.

56:30>> Yeah. I mean, obviously like I don't

56:33like I don't take out much money from

56:35the company. I take out me and Ben split

56:38our expenses and it's like 2500 a month

56:41each for each of us. And then I also

56:45take out 5K to invest in index funds

56:48because if I invest

56:51until I retire, which I'll never retire,

56:53but if I invest until like I don't know,

56:54let's say like 65, then I will have 25

56:57million. If I just keep investing my

56:59five grand into index funds and I could

57:02double that and I could do 10 grand a

57:04month and I probably retire with like

57:05double if I start now. So it's boring

57:09but it works.

57:10>> Yeah. So, okay, that's pretty frugal, I

57:14would say, to have 5K,

57:15>> but I live in Wisconsin, so

57:17>> yeah.

57:18>> Yeah.

57:18>> Just you see all these other uh

57:2020-year-old millionaires like doing all

57:22this crazy stuff, traveling the world,

57:24spending 100K at the club or on villas,

57:27etc. Um, has that just never like

57:30aligned with you or anything? Like,

57:32>> is there anything that you purchased

57:34that was material that was a bit

57:35expensive?

57:36>> Honestly, never. I mean, like besides

57:40like the investment properties,

57:42but I drive like a mediocre car, live in

57:46a mediocre ranch.

57:49I don't know. I buy like Instacart

57:51groceries. I don't know. Um, we do have

57:53a nice like gym membership, but that's

57:57pretty much it. Yeah, I think I will. I

57:59mean, I don't know why like I've been

58:01investing the same amount even when we

58:02made like 50k a month. So, I just need

58:04to up that. But yeah, I don't really

58:07care about that stuff. I do want a nice

58:09house one day, but I think part of me is

58:12also just like, wow, that's like what I

58:14want is probably really expensive.

58:16>> H what keeps you from getting a house

58:18right now?

58:20>> Um

58:22I don't know. I think it's just like

58:24I've never bought something big and nice

58:26like that for myself. So I think part of

58:28me just isn't ready.

58:31>> Yeah, I'm I'm big on not getting a house

58:33right now. uh because it just seems like

58:36less convenient for the business, you

58:38know, because if you're like in an

58:39apartment, all the things are taken care

58:42of, all the amenities. Uh

58:43>> like our place for instance, we have a

58:45gym uh that's like you walk out of our

58:47door and then it's the door to the gym.

58:49So, I'm just like all about efficiency.

58:51Um she really wants a house though. Um

58:54>> but no crazy lavish expenses. What's

58:57like something you've purchased that

59:00like since you've had some money that's

59:01been helpful for like investing in you,

59:04you know, like walking treadmill?

59:07>> Oh, yeah.

59:08>> Like chef, personal chef, like anything

59:11like that?

59:12>> Um, I will say like once we started

59:15making money, we never shop. Like it's

59:17all Instacart, Door Dash, Uber Eats. I

59:20will say we do cuz like some of that

59:21stuff the business will pay for. Also,

59:24all my sweatuits, my walking treadmill

59:27for sure. I walk. So, I like to walk. I

59:29like to get it over with. I'm all about

59:30getting things over with. That's what I

59:32think about. So, I'll walk four miles

59:35right when I get up when I'm working

59:37just to get it done. Um, and then

59:41probably our gym membership. We do want

59:43a home gym, so that'll probably be like

59:46our next big thing. So, that'll probably

59:48be like a couple tens of thousands. But

59:51yeah, it's all I can really think of.

59:54>> Were you guys athletes in high school?

59:56>> Oh, yeah. I mean, I wasn't. I've always

59:58like went to the gym. Um, I think I

1:00:00started freshman year and I always just

1:00:02did like either a four or six day split

1:00:04and then Ben in high school, he wrestled

1:00:07a ton. Um, he did like club and then he

1:00:13also did school. I don't know if you

1:00:14guys familiar with like Ben Ascrin, but

1:00:16he's like the only big wrestler from

1:00:18Wisconsin, but he has like his academy.

1:00:21Um, so Ben like went there and so he was

1:00:25really good at wrestling and went to

1:00:26state every year. And then also

1:00:28football. He loved football, but not

1:00:30like enough to ever go to like college

1:00:33for it or anything or make it worth it

1:00:34to go to college, but uh yeah, so he

1:00:37always did sports and then now we just

1:00:39go to the gym together. And what's kind

1:00:40of your uh mission or goal with all of

1:00:44this

1:00:45>> uh long term? I really do like what Alex

1:00:48and Leela do, but like where they

1:00:51obviously they're in private equity um

1:00:53and they work with a lot of businesses

1:00:54and help them grow um and invest in them

1:00:58potentially that with Ben, but I don't

1:01:01know like right now we're just really

1:01:02loving growing our own companies. But I

1:01:04know I probably want to have all like

1:01:07his business and my business and other

1:01:09businesses under a portfolio in the

1:01:11future. So that's probably

1:01:145 years from now we'll start.

1:01:16>> So you plan on doing the exact business

1:01:18you're doing right now for five more

1:01:20years.

1:01:21>> I can't promise that. But like I'll for

1:01:23sure own it for a long time but I don't

1:01:26want to be doing like daily what I'm

1:01:28doing right now in five years. I want to

1:01:30grow. I want to get out of that. I want

1:01:31to I feel like I went really hardcore

1:01:35back into working in the business and I

1:01:37need to get back out of it once we get

1:01:39the right people. So that's like my goal

1:01:41within the next 6 months. But

1:01:44yeah, long term I don't want to just do

1:01:48this forever. I see bigger things. I

1:01:50want to be a billionaire. I do. I think

1:01:52that's just like a goal because I know I

1:01:54can do it. Not even for like the money

1:01:56because obviously I don't even buy stuff

1:01:58now, but just to prove to myself that I

1:02:00can.

1:02:01>> Okay. Would you sell the business you

1:02:03have right now? I know there's

1:02:05interesting multiples on uh service

1:02:08business. Is it like 2 to 3x of yearly

1:02:10revenue or

1:02:11>> agencies? It's 6 to9.

1:02:13>> It's 6 to9. I guess it's recurring.

1:02:16Okay. I didn't think about that.

1:02:18>> Yeah. If you have contracts,

1:02:19>> I was thinking of coaching businesses

1:02:20for some reason. That's a little less.

1:02:22Um that's actually service. I actually

1:02:24learned that at the workshop yesterday.

1:02:26>> 6 to9x. Okay.

1:02:28>> So, what would be your goal revenue with

1:02:29this business before you sold it?

1:02:32>> Oh, I want to build this to at least

1:02:34like I want to sell it for if I did for

1:02:37at least 100red million.

1:02:40>> Yeah. I don't know. Like I don't I think

1:02:44the money excites me less than like

1:02:46being the best

1:02:49uh for short form content for business

1:02:50owners, but I know if we are, we'll just

1:02:53make a ton of money.

1:02:54>> Interesting. And what do you think would

1:02:57aside from removing yourself from the

1:02:59day-to-day uh stuff, like what do you

1:03:01think would 10x the business?

1:03:03>> Just time. I mean, it's already growing

1:03:05so quick. Like after that video in

1:03:08August, we were growing like we grew I

1:03:12think like 200k just that month in

1:03:15reoccurring revenue and like with social

1:03:18media you just have the power to do that

1:03:20with your business. So we can grow it

1:03:25fairly quickly but to 10x it. Yeah. It's

1:03:27just time and consistency.

1:03:30>> Have you thought about moving to Puerto

1:03:32Rico with that much cash flow?

1:03:34>> Why? Puerto Rico. I learned this

1:03:36recently from a guest. Uh it's the only

1:03:38place in the US you can move to uh like

1:03:42keep your residency and you pay I think

1:03:44it's 3% income tax and then 0% capital

1:03:49gains. Um maybe it's 6% but I don't know

1:03:53what it is in Wisconsin, but it probably

1:03:55be like 40% 50% a year goes to the IRS.

1:03:58But

1:03:58>> yeah, it's 40%.

1:04:00>> Puerto Rico's 3%.

1:04:03>> Yeah. I I if some really wealthy people

1:04:05live there. It's a nice place. I would

1:04:06recommend checking it out. Um there's

1:04:08like this place called Dorado there and

1:04:10it's Do you know the Ritz Carlton? Like

1:04:13>> Yeah.

1:04:14>> Um it's essentially like built by them

1:04:17and you just basically live in this like

1:04:19Dorado bubble of like all these nice

1:04:21amenities, etc. Um and it's not too

1:04:24expensive to live there. It's fairly

1:04:25cheap. Um and yeah, you don't pay any

1:04:28taxes. It's pretty interesting. Yeah, I

1:04:30like my my quarterly tax bill is like

1:04:33multiple hundreds of thousands. It

1:04:34sucks.

1:04:35>> Yeah, LA's pretty rough, too.

1:04:37>> Yeah, I can imagine.

1:04:38>> Um definitely want to get out of here.

1:04:40But I I'm like big on if

1:04:42>> I think I can make more money in Los

1:04:44Angeles than like a place like Texas or

1:04:47Las Vegas at this stage just because

1:04:49>> primarily because I host a podcast and a

1:04:51lot of people come through here.

1:04:52>> Yeah. Um, people usually come through

1:04:55Vegas, Los Angeles, and Miami, but the

1:04:57other parts of the country they don't

1:04:59really come to. But someone told me I

1:05:00could move to Puerto Rico and fly people

1:05:02out and it would be cheaper. And I was

1:05:04like, this is true. I wanted to ask

1:05:06about Minihat in general because you're

1:05:08kind of one of the first people to use

1:05:09it super effectively. Like, uh, what's

1:05:12your Minihat system secret sauce on

1:05:14that? That actually reminds me like this

1:05:17is random, but I've gotten like reached

1:05:20out to by Many Chat to work with them a

1:05:22lot, but I just like literally anything

1:05:24that will take me away from PBL will

1:05:26like I just won't do it.

1:05:28>> But anyway, I use them cuz I love them,

1:05:29but I never like do affiliates or

1:05:31anything. But Many Chat, like Do you

1:05:34want me to break it down just in case?

1:05:35>> Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

1:05:36>> Okay. So basically what many chat is is

1:05:38when people say as like a call to action

1:05:42on Instagram, comment the word cake and

1:05:45I'll send you you know whatever. So it's

1:05:47when you like share like lead magnets

1:05:49with people or you know freebies,

1:05:52landing pages about your service and

1:05:54it's like the best way to get leads from

1:05:58Instagram because people will just

1:05:59comment that word and then they will get

1:06:00automatically sent a DM from you to that

1:06:03link.

1:06:03>> How do you use it differently than other

1:06:05people? um like in a more effective way

1:06:08like is there anything like in the

1:06:09funnel specifically?

1:06:10>> Yeah. So, I would say like

1:06:14I I think a big part of like why I grew

1:06:17really fast during some periods is cuz

1:06:20like sometimes I just use ManyHat a lot

1:06:22more and I'll create a lot more freebies

1:06:24and especially when you create a really

1:06:26really good freebie that like was

1:06:28clearly like it took you a lot of time

1:06:30and it's not just something that you can

1:06:31make in chat GBT or something you can

1:06:34like is a Google search away like those

1:06:37are so valuable and

1:06:38>> what's an example of one of yours?

1:06:39>> Yeah. So, I think one of them that took

1:06:42me so long was it's called an a

1:06:44thousand. It was like it's a freebie

1:06:45with a thousand hooks. So, it's like a

1:06:48thousand videos that follow the 5x rule

1:06:50that are like good educational content

1:06:52examples from business owners and then

1:06:55like those hooks templatized so people

1:06:58can use them themselves. So, like it has

1:07:00the link to the viral video and then the

1:07:02template templatized hook for a

1:07:03thousand.

1:07:05And that like actually making that

1:07:07probably taught me the most about

1:07:08content I've ever learned. But yeah,

1:07:11that um took probably like 300 hours to

1:07:15make cuz you had to scroll like I had a

1:07:17bunch saved of reals I love and a huge

1:07:20bank of those, but I was super selective

1:07:22about what I put on the freebie. I

1:07:24probably scrolled through like 20,000

1:07:26videos to find, you know, the other like

1:07:29700 I needed. That's a really good one

1:07:31because I saw people after you did that

1:07:34uh start selling ebooks of that and

1:07:36running literally copy and pasted.

1:07:39>> That makes sense. Yeah, that's the thing

1:07:41about a lead magnet is people can just

1:07:43monetize it differently than you and

1:07:44steal it

1:07:45>> because you're giving it away for free.

1:07:47Huh.

1:07:47>> Do you run any ads?

1:07:49>> No.

1:07:51>> Yeah.

1:07:51>> Jesus. Sorry.

1:07:53>> Yeah. Do you just like like what's the I

1:07:57might cut this out, but just like my

1:07:58genuine curiosity is like what's keeping

1:08:01this from like being bigger? Like do you

1:08:04have too many leads and you can't like

1:08:07fulfill on all of them?

1:08:08>> It's really just about me getting out

1:08:10cuz like right now

1:08:13like I will always work as much as

1:08:14needed to get it done but like there's

1:08:17only so much I can work. So

1:08:19>> why don't you charge more?

1:08:21>> I could. I just I don't I don't know. I

1:08:25mean, I raise my prices quite

1:08:26frequently, so I've raised them

1:08:29probably.

1:08:31They've probably doubled in the past

1:08:346 months.

1:08:35>> So, it's 6K now or

1:08:37>> No, I actually I want to say year. So,

1:08:40it used to be like half of what it is

1:08:42now. But also, we've built out the

1:08:44service a little bit more. So like we

1:08:47like to do for example like we'll do

1:08:49setup many chat for you and um we had to

1:08:53add like customer success managers so we

1:08:55added in like milestones checking calls

1:08:57cuz that's what people really wanted. So

1:08:59it's built out more so we also had to

1:09:01charge more but the price has probably

1:09:03doubled in the past year but like I

1:09:05don't know I feel like we're at a good

1:09:08price point but I know I could charge

1:09:09more if I wanted.

1:09:11>> Interesting.

1:09:12>> Yeah

1:09:12>> cuz I I tried to sell like a similar

1:09:15thing. I just tried to sell the coaching

1:09:16aspect. Um, and like I was trying to

1:09:20charge people like

1:09:2270 80 like 90k packages over like 6

1:09:24months. Uh, cuz I've had a lot of

1:09:26success coaching people in the past. Uh,

1:09:28but

1:09:29>> it essentially what I realized was the

1:09:31price wasn't an issue for them, but what

1:09:34they wanted was services. So, I was

1:09:35like, I could literally sell like

1:09:38services similar to yours for like 80k.

1:09:41So, I just like I think I got on a call

1:09:43with one of your sales reps way back

1:09:44just to see what the pricing was and I

1:09:46was like, "It's only $3,000." There

1:09:48hasn't been anyone that you've sold like

1:09:49a super high ticket package to.

1:09:52>> No, like anytime someone comes to me for

1:09:54like coaching or anything, like I hate

1:09:58calls.

1:09:59>> I don't do calls. Like even this is like

1:10:01wild for me. Yeah.

1:10:02>> Um, so I try to do calls as little as

1:10:04possible and like I just I just like

1:10:08helping people like do the grunt work

1:10:10and the service and like I feel like

1:10:13with business owners too, they want

1:10:15people just to do it for them.

1:10:17>> Exactly.

1:10:17>> Yeah. So that's why the done for you

1:10:19model works so well. But I think we will

1:10:21probably raise their prices again soon

1:10:23just because

1:10:25I do like the clientele that we get with

1:10:27a higher price point. They kind of get

1:10:29it more. Um, and I love the people who

1:10:32just like trust us to do what we do best

1:10:35and like don't I guess like try to redo

1:10:39all the work. Like I said earlier, like

1:10:40everyone thinks they're a great

1:10:41marketer. Like

1:10:42>> they just trust us. They trust the

1:10:44research we've done. They trust the

1:10:46scripts and they just trust the process.

1:10:48>> Do you have any churn or do you have

1:10:50like any failures? I'm assuming it's

1:10:52like a little bit but not much.

1:10:53>> I mean, every agency has churn. And I

1:10:56think with content, organic content,

1:10:59it's something that takes time. So like

1:11:02when we have people churn, it's because

1:11:04of two reasons. One, they just don't

1:11:07want to wait. But like remember how I

1:11:09was telling you it took Carl and myself

1:11:123 months to get our first multi-million

1:11:14view viral video. Well, those changed

1:11:16our accounts and our businesses and our

1:11:18lives, but most people can't wait three

1:11:21months. Um, with like when you're

1:11:24starting a new account and you need to

1:11:25consistently post, when you have like a

1:11:27bigger account, we can just study what

1:11:29already worked for you and do research

1:11:30based off that. Like we can grow you

1:11:32faster. But if you're starting scratch

1:11:33from scratch, like people um who aren't

1:11:36willing to wait, they might churn. And

1:11:39then also like the only part of our

1:11:42service that isn't done for you is the

1:11:43filming because it's their personal

1:11:44brand. So people who just don't end up

1:11:47filming.

1:11:48>> Have you thought about doing the filming

1:11:50part for them or is that pretty

1:11:52logistically tough?

1:11:53>> I mean because it's their personal brand

1:11:55like it just wouldn't make sense like

1:11:57because it's more so like them just not

1:11:58wanting to be on camera

1:12:00>> or I guess sometimes it's not. It's them

1:12:01not having the time. But like, yeah,

1:12:04some people just like

1:12:07can't can't film. They just don't like

1:12:09it.

1:12:10>> Interesting. I'm guessing it's a lot on

1:12:12the iPhone. I've ran into a lot of

1:12:14people who are like, "Oh, like I need

1:12:15someone like a video crew around me all

1:12:17the time." I'm like, I don't think you

1:12:18would do well.

1:12:19>> Yeah. I film all my stuff on my phone.

1:12:21>> Yeah.

1:12:21>> Yeah. Even my VSSL. Like

1:12:24>> what I'm so impressed by you just from

1:12:25personal perspective is like I have the

1:12:28worst shiny object syndrome ever. Uh

1:12:31which is why I did a podcast cuz it was

1:12:33like like how can I be like find out

1:12:37about people's businesses um like new

1:12:39ones all the time just cuz I crave like

1:12:41this novelty but um like it's just so

1:12:45impressive that you just dialed in on

1:12:46this one thing and take nothing. Like

1:12:48where do you get that from you think?

1:12:50>> Yeah. Yeah. So, I feel like there's like

1:12:52I feel like every entrepreneur has ADHD,

1:12:54but I feel like there's two types where

1:12:56it's like one's kind of like shiny

1:12:57object and then the other one is like

1:12:59hyperfixation.

1:13:01And like I'm the type of person where I

1:13:03will eat the same things every day. I'll

1:13:05wake up at the same time every day. I

1:13:07will watch the same shows over and over

1:13:09again because I know them. I'll read the

1:13:11same books over again. Like I am just so

1:13:13used to like I don't know. I hyperfixate

1:13:15a lot and I think that's why. But also

1:13:18it scaled so big. So now I like I don't

1:13:21have any desire to like start anything

1:13:23else from scratch. I mean in the future

1:13:26yeah

1:13:27um that business with Ben. But

1:13:29>> what kind of people do you look at for

1:13:31just general business advice for

1:13:33mentorship uh for social media

1:13:36understanding virality like who are you

1:13:38looking to there? Yeah, I would say like

1:13:42business-wise for Mosy obviously.

1:13:45And then

1:13:47for

1:13:49um social media, a lot of it is just

1:13:52like consumption, but scrolling

1:13:54intentionally versus like

1:13:56subconsciously.

1:13:58Um and then there's this one

1:14:02girl on Instagram. She's like or on

1:14:05YouTube. She's kind of like a hidden

1:14:06gem. I feel like she does not get the

1:14:08credit she deserves. But she breaks down

1:14:11specifically YouTube content so well,

1:14:13but a lot of it transfers over to

1:14:15shorts. Her name is April Lynn Alter,

1:14:18and you should check her out. Like,

1:14:20she's insane. Like, her videos are so

1:14:22value packed, and it like motivates me

1:14:24to do the same with short form content.

1:14:26Like, when you watch her video, it's

1:14:28like the most valuable thing you've ever

1:14:29seen. I can't explain it. You just have

1:14:31to watch it.

1:14:32>> Interesting. Do you have any like

1:14:33particular bits that you've learned from

1:14:35her or is it really just how she crafts

1:14:37the videos themselves that you're

1:14:38looking at? Yeah. So, I always

1:14:41understood the concept of outliers on

1:14:43people's page, but like she kind of came

1:14:45up with that term and she does the exact

1:14:48same thing on just YouTube and like I'm

1:14:51like and she talks about formats on

1:14:54YouTube all the time and like all that

1:14:55stuff just transfers over to content and

1:14:58like I've always understood like the

1:15:00concept of formats and stuff but like

1:15:01she kind of put it into actual terms.

1:15:05>> Mhm.

1:15:05>> We were talking about shiny object

1:15:07syndrome a minute ago. Like what have

1:15:08been some of your shiny object syndromes

1:15:11you've had in the past year with this

1:15:13business? Like I know Tik Tok shop is

1:15:15really big. There's like softwares you

1:15:17could do a course. Like what have been

1:15:19some things that you've been tempted to

1:15:20do but maybe just um you haven't really

1:15:23thought about it.

1:15:25>> Um I would say like I'm pretty loyal to

1:15:28like I'm like super loyal to everything

1:15:31but this business I'm very loyal to and

1:15:33like I don't have too much of that. But

1:15:35I will say the only other thing I have

1:15:38kind of like wanted to do but I know it

1:15:40will take time away is like starting a

1:15:42YouTube channel about short form

1:15:44content. There's one person I really

1:15:45like. His name is Callaway and he's like

1:15:48I say in like the past few months he's

1:15:50recently started posting and he's

1:15:53already grown his channel like 60k. Um

1:15:56and he does it really well. And

1:15:59obviously April and Alter who I

1:16:01mentioned earlier, like she does it so

1:16:02well and like I would love to do that

1:16:04and I know it would probably get a ton

1:16:06of leads as well cuz like long form you

1:16:09just build a different type of trust

1:16:10with people. So I think it would work

1:16:12really well but

1:16:14I don't know. I just

1:16:16I've also been advised by people like oh

1:16:18no you shouldn't do that. So I'm like

1:16:20okay.

1:16:21>> How about organizationally? Like um what

1:16:23are some how do you organize your

1:16:25business to like scale? Yeah. So, I

1:16:28would say like I know this is just so

1:16:31like scrappy, but Google Drive, we have

1:16:33all of our SOPs in Google Drive. We have

1:16:36all of our client scripts, our client

1:16:38videos, files. Like every client gets a

1:16:40folder. It has their unedited content

1:16:42folder, their edited content folder,

1:16:44their scripts folder, and then like um

1:16:48we do stories for some people too like

1:16:51um and we'll just use ManyHat through

1:16:53that as well. So their stories folder

1:16:55and it's just like very neat in there

1:16:58and we'll have like in those folders

1:17:00will be like May 2025, March 2025. So it

1:17:03just all kind of like lines up. But

1:17:05yeah, pretty much Google Drive and then

1:17:09softwares that I use would be like go

1:17:11high level um for a CRM. Many chat

1:17:14obviously pretty simple obviously like

1:17:16Google Drive, Gmail.

1:17:17>> Do you have any advice for posting on

1:17:19social media? Like uh do you make sure

1:17:21the people are in the US? Do you make

1:17:23sure it's like an iPhone posted at

1:17:24certain times, like that kind of stuff?

1:17:26>> Yeah. So, all of our account managers

1:17:28like are US-based because of that

1:17:30reason. Um, because it's just for the

1:17:34best if the IP is in the US. Um, and

1:17:37then I used to be actually like a huge

1:17:39proponent of manually posting. Uh,

1:17:42because I always did like different

1:17:43split tests with like different third

1:17:44party platforms, meta and then manual

1:17:47and manual always outperformed. But then

1:17:49a month ago, I redid it with Meta and it

1:17:52was the same.

1:17:54>> So, everyone on my team loves me now

1:17:56because they don't have to manually post

1:17:57anymore.

1:17:58>> That's good to know. My team will

1:18:00probably like that as well. Um,

1:18:01>> yeah, I like never trusted it. And I But

1:18:04like Meta, it was the same cuz I did it

1:18:06on my account, too. I was like, "Okay,

1:18:07if I'm going to try it, I'll do it on

1:18:08mine." And it was the same. Yeah, that

1:18:11was a big one for us on I can't remember

1:18:13what platform specifically didn't work

1:18:15when the IP was outside of the US or No,

1:18:18it was it was like we would use a VPN

1:18:21but the SIM and the iPhone wasn't from

1:18:24the US. I think it was YouTube and Tik

1:18:26Tok it didn't work well but Instagram

1:18:27and Facebook was fine but now I just

1:18:29make sure it's all posted in the US

1:18:32except except for Facebook and Snapchat

1:18:34spotlight I think. Um

1:18:36>> but are you posting on Facebook pretty

1:18:38consistently? Um, yeah, but I have like

1:18:41the automation set up. So, if it just

1:18:43like if you post on your Instagram, it

1:18:44will automatically post on Facebook.

1:18:46>> Huh. Interesting. We We set it up to

1:18:50where it's differently posted, but it's

1:18:53because you can put a link in the

1:18:55Facebook caption. Um, which is like a

1:18:58huge conversion thing. She actually

1:18:59taught me that. Um,

1:19:01>> you know what? I'm going to I'm just

1:19:02going to write that down really quick.

1:19:03Just give me a second. So, what exactly

1:19:06do you do? Yeah. So, you can post on

1:19:08Facebook the link for whatever you're

1:19:10promoting. Like, say it's this podcast,

1:19:12I could post a clip of us and I could

1:19:14put the cap the link directly in the

1:19:16caption for it.

1:19:17>> Okay. And that's like, is that a real or

1:19:18just a post?

1:19:19>> Uh, either or. Yeah. Can do reals.

1:19:21>> Oh, wow.

1:19:22>> But it's crazy.

1:19:23>> I have to post that on on Instagram. Be

1:19:25like, "Hey guys, you can do this."

1:19:27>> Yeah. And then you can also do pin

1:19:28comment on Facebook um with the link in

1:19:31there, which is nice. You used to be

1:19:32able to do that on shorts, but

1:19:34>> can you get ManyHat to work on Tik Tok?

1:19:36>> That's new. Yeah. Um, as of like two

1:19:39months ago, I haven't set it up yet.

1:19:42>> I haven't been able to get it to work,

1:19:44but I know it would like crush if I

1:19:46could

1:19:46>> cuz no one's doing it, you know. Um,

1:19:48>> that's what I was thinking about with

1:19:50Tik Tok shop, too. I wanted to launch

1:19:51like a some low ticket product just to

1:19:53push my videos more because if you

1:19:56scroll on Tik Tok, I don't know your

1:19:57opinion on Tik Tok versus Instagram. I

1:19:59don't like Tik Tok anymore.

1:20:00>> I don't I don't like Tik Tok. I don't

1:20:02even use it.

1:20:02>> Yeah, cuz you scroll and there's um

1:20:07it's only like edits because they're

1:20:09trying to push cap cut um like cap cut

1:20:12templates and then it's

1:20:14>> um

1:20:14>> just Tik Tok shop ads and then it's

1:20:16sponsored post and then occasionally

1:20:18you'll see like a viral video or like a

1:20:20normal viral video that's not an ad.

1:20:22>> But Instagram it's like there's no ads

1:20:23on it. There's no shop. Um, a big one

1:20:26too is I think they silence so many,

1:20:29this is just my opinion from like having

1:20:30a predominantly male audience. Uh, like

1:20:33they silence so many conservative

1:20:34creators on Tik Tok and like anyone in

1:20:36the conservative politics side or like

1:20:38any like alpha masculine stuff that they

1:20:41all went to Instagram. So like Tik Tok

1:20:43is kind of girls um and then Instagram

1:20:46is kind of guys. I don't know.

1:20:48>> I agree with that.

1:20:50>> Yeah. But I think Instagram, this isn't

1:20:52a word, but I think Instagram is like

1:20:54Tik Tokifying itself. I think the value

1:20:56of a follower has decreased cuz I think

1:20:58more people treat the reals tab like a

1:21:02for you page

1:21:04>> and it's kind of getting like a little

1:21:07more like Tik Tok. I would think

1:21:08Instagram your followers are way more

1:21:10valuable than they are on Tik Tok. Cuz

1:21:12on Tik Tok people will follow you but

1:21:13they only go on the for you page. So

1:21:15they won't like see you really ever

1:21:17again. But Instagram followers a little

1:21:20bit more loyal. But I think the real tab

1:21:23is kind of turning into the for you

1:21:24page.

1:21:25>> Yeah, I agree.

1:21:26>> But I still think like Instagram all day

1:21:29like will change your business. So yeah,

1:21:32>> YouTube shorts sucks. My personal

1:21:34opinion. I don't know.

1:21:36>> Actually, I just hit 100K in my personal

1:21:38YouTube. Can't wait to get my plaque.

1:21:40>> Nice. Um but yeah, the YouTube algorithm

1:21:43is so weird. It doesn't make any sense.

1:21:46I do think too like I've seen people

1:21:48ruin their YouTube pages from posting

1:21:50shorts and getting followers from shorts

1:21:52that like they're they won't watch their

1:21:54long form videos so they won't get

1:21:55pushed out.

1:21:56>> 100%. I mean me me the big mistake I

1:21:59made with this podcast is that I had a

1:22:01crime niche and then I didn't make a new

1:22:03channel. Um you probably saw that and

1:22:05were like what is this guy doing?

1:22:06>> No. My dad So my dad was like so he's

1:22:08like into crime and I was like no he

1:22:10used to do that. Like it's not like that

1:22:12anymore. Well, the goal of the podcast

1:22:14originally was to do famous crime cases

1:22:18of people, but I couldn't get anyone.

1:22:21>> So, I just switched it to business.

1:22:23>> So, it just became business. I was like,

1:22:25I'm more more interested in business

1:22:26anyway.

1:22:27>> Mhm.

1:22:28>> And then some videos started to work,

1:22:30but even my viral ones, like I have a

1:22:32couple podcasts with like a million

1:22:33views, and they all the viewers are old

1:22:38viewers from the crime channel, which is

1:22:40so strange. It's just people who so

1:22:42happen to watch that video.

1:22:44>> Yeah, YouTube algo is kind of strange.

1:22:46How important are Instagram stories? And

1:22:48do you have any like advice for

1:22:49Instagram stories?

1:22:51>> Yeah, so

1:22:53I like I love Instagram stories. I think

1:22:55they're the best way for leads and like

1:22:57you can be pretty salesy on stories cuz

1:22:59like your uh most loyal followers are

1:23:02going to be looking at your stories

1:23:03every single day. So, if you post

1:23:05personal content and then also just

1:23:08social proof of results your product or

1:23:10service has gotten before and after

1:23:12pictures, not written, you will get

1:23:14leads if you just link your landing page

1:23:16or you put a many chat CTA on the story.

1:23:19So, I would post a story a day with some

1:23:22sort of social proof or before and after

1:23:25or lead results of clients.

1:23:27>> What's the most amount of money you've

1:23:28made from an Instagram story? Oh, it's

1:23:31like very like I would say

1:23:34500 clicks a day is like what I get from

1:23:37stories to the landing page and like

1:23:39it's just so consistent. I I I don't

1:23:42know the exact metrics on what that

1:23:43converts into. We are setting up

1:23:45tracking right now, but that is one I

1:23:48should set up because I don't know,

1:23:50>> but it could be maybe 3,000 6,000 a day

1:23:53if those clicks led to one client,

1:23:55something like that.

1:23:57>> Okay. And then stories. Um, do you have

1:24:00like an email list set up?

1:24:02>> Yeah, but I don't I don't really do it

1:24:05very often. I should do it like I should

1:24:06be better. I have an email list and for

1:24:09a while I did it like weekly, but I just

1:24:13kind of stopped writing emails.

1:24:14>> Yeah, it it's something someone was

1:24:16telling me to do cuz it's a valuable way

1:24:18to own your audience.

1:24:19>> It is. It is. And I know I should do it

1:24:21and the Hermosi team always says to do

1:24:23it, but I I

1:24:25>> Do you collect emails on the landing

1:24:26page?

1:24:27>> Mhm. So for like some freebies, I will

1:24:29just link directly to like the freebie

1:24:31so they can get it right away. But for

1:24:33like the a thousand hooks one, they have

1:24:35to opt in. So that's where we will

1:24:37collect the emails.

1:24:39>> Did you Were you the person that made

1:24:40the video that it was like it might have

1:24:42been someone else. It's like here's how

1:24:43you set up a mini chat automation that

1:24:45makes them follow you first.

1:24:46>> No, I haven't done that.

1:24:47>> Gotcha. That was something I did

1:24:49recently that started converting crazy.

1:24:51>> I had no idea that was a thing. Is that

1:24:54a thing? Okay, I'm writing this down,

1:24:56too. Okay.

1:24:58>> Um, yeah.

1:24:58>> Wow, that's crazy.

1:25:00>> I did that on the Hormosi when he collab

1:25:02posted me and I was gaining

1:25:04>> that video got like 3 million views,

1:25:05right?

1:25:06>> So, the original account it was gaining

1:25:10like it had a million in 2 hours. Um,

1:25:12and he collab posted it and then it

1:25:14started gaining me like 2,000 followers

1:25:17every like 10 minutes. Um, and then the

1:25:19account got banned that day and I was

1:25:21like, geez, that was so inconvenient

1:25:23timing. But

1:25:24>> yeah, I changed it. It used to be like

1:25:26collect an email um for the newsletter,

1:25:28but I was like, I'd rather have people

1:25:30follow me.

1:25:31>> Wow, I did not know that was a thing.

1:25:32So, they just have to follow you and

1:25:34then they get the freebie or what?

1:25:36>> Yeah, it's like um make sure you're

1:25:38following me so I can send this to you

1:25:40and then

1:25:41>> Oh, so it's like is it is it like um a

1:25:44button they have to click or is it just

1:25:45like a message and once they follow you

1:25:47it will trigger?

1:25:48>> Yeah. Yeah. So, it's if they don't

1:25:50follow, um, it goes, "Make sure you're

1:25:52following me so I can send it to you."

1:25:54And then they click just followed after

1:25:55they do it and then they get it

1:25:57>> and then if they already follow you,

1:25:58they get it right away.

1:25:59>> Yeah.

1:25:59>> Okay. Wow. That is so genius.

1:26:02>> Yeah. Um, that's been pretty helpful for

1:26:04us. But do you have any uh just personal

1:26:08curiosity like ideas for marketing a

1:26:11podcast uh with short form content? Like

1:26:13how would you be thinking about it?

1:26:15>> I would do exactly what you're doing.

1:26:16clipping like collabing with the people

1:26:19because especially because of the like

1:26:21highc caliber guest you have on.

1:26:23>> How do you feel about the uh I've been

1:26:25making it was for my old page but I've

1:26:27been making some content that's like uh

1:26:30here's what Alex Ramoszi taught me in

1:26:32144 minutes or like this is what I I

1:26:34flew to Vegas to see Alex Ramos and

1:26:36here's what he told me. Like do you

1:26:37think those videos are important for

1:26:39getting people to care about long form

1:26:41content or do you think just the clips

1:26:43is what you would think about? No,

1:26:44>> I would do a mix of both.

1:26:46But I mean, how many videos of those

1:26:49have you done in the past and how have

1:26:50they done?

1:26:51>> I've done like five or six marketing

1:26:54videos and they all got like several

1:26:56hundred thousand or like a million

1:26:57views.

1:26:58>> Okay. If it's working then just double

1:26:59down on it.

1:27:00>> Yeah. I I just I couldn't tell if like I

1:27:03think about congruency a lot. Like

1:27:05people see this thing and they want more

1:27:06of this thing. So I'm like how does me

1:27:08talking about doing a podcast make them

1:27:11want to watch it? I guess was my

1:27:12thought. But I don't know.

1:27:15I guess just a general question like how

1:27:16do you make people care about you and

1:27:18like how do you build like a cult on

1:27:21social media?

1:27:22>> Yeah.

1:27:22>> Or do you just think about it from um

1:27:24this is the video convert to this

1:27:26funnel? I would say

1:27:29obviously make valuable educational

1:27:32content, but like if you look at Hermosy

1:27:35for example, he like is just or Leela

1:27:39like they are just people. You get to

1:27:41love their personality and like all

1:27:43their little quirks and over time like

1:27:45you learn so much from them and like you

1:27:48just know them for certain things and

1:27:51that's kind of like how you make people

1:27:53love you. just showing your personal

1:27:54like your personality in your videos,

1:27:57just not being fake.

1:27:58>> Like the sweatuits and stuff like that's

1:28:00just my thing. And I think those little

1:28:01things just add up. But like you have to

1:28:04you have to post for a long time and you

1:28:08just have to be consistent with the

1:28:09things you do. But like I think those

1:28:13little things that people notice that

1:28:14just is comes with like posting for

1:28:16years.

1:28:18>> Mhm.

1:28:19But I like I'm trying to think of a good

1:28:21example like there's this one girl in

1:28:24the fitness niche I love because in her

1:28:27videos she talks about like volume

1:28:29eating for example but she'll like post

1:28:32like or she'll add little like meme

1:28:36what are they called like sound effects

1:28:38within her videos and it just makes it

1:28:40so funny and like you can just tell

1:28:42she's a funny person. She has like a

1:28:43very strong Irish accent and like I've

1:28:46only seen like three of her videos, but

1:28:48that made me follow her cuz I just kept

1:28:50seeing it and I I don't really follow

1:28:52many people and like just those little

1:28:54things um just made me like really like

1:28:56her personality even though she was

1:28:58sharing the same advice as a lot of

1:28:59other people.

1:29:00>> Do you think those things are important

1:29:02for making money though? Like the having

1:29:06different elements of your brand? I

1:29:07talked to Alex about this and I was

1:29:08like, "Do you think it makes you more

1:29:10money that you talk about fitness um and

1:29:14like your nutrition and what kind of

1:29:16clothes you wear?" Um, and he kind of

1:29:19hinted at no, not really.

1:29:20>> Yeah, cuz he used to post more about

1:29:23that stuff, but then he basically said

1:29:27he got the least amount of leads from

1:29:29that stuff. So, I think really obviously

1:29:32focusing on your niche and your content,

1:29:33but adding those little things in within

1:29:35like videos about your main thing. So,

1:29:38like I talk about Ben occasionally, but

1:29:42only in videos that primarily are

1:29:44talking about like what I do or business

1:29:48cuz I never want people to follow me

1:29:49just for Ben because that's not what I

1:29:51post about.

1:29:52>> How do you use AI in Chad GBT to go

1:29:55viral? Um, I would say the biggest

1:29:59mistake is using it to write your

1:30:00scripts. Um, we'll see people doing that

1:30:03a lot.

1:30:04You can use it for research. I think

1:30:06it's great for research, but using it to

1:30:08write your scripts, I wouldn't recommend

1:30:10unless like you completely refine it

1:30:12after. But I think it's great for

1:30:14research or for example we'll do like

1:30:17clone videos where it's like you're

1:30:19comparing like I said like with Carl the

1:30:22two franchises and you're getting all

1:30:23the numbers and it's like okay you have

1:30:25Burger King, you have McDonald's, you

1:30:27need to like how much do you have to

1:30:28invest in each franchise up front.

1:30:30What's the first year of revenue look

1:30:31like and all these things you can just

1:30:34type in like a prompt and it will just

1:30:37give you that information right away

1:30:38instead of having to manually research

1:30:40it like on 50 different sites. So yeah,

1:30:43it makes research a lot faster.

1:30:45>> How about you specifically for your

1:30:47business? Like what's been the most uh

1:30:50useful way you've used AI? It might be a

1:30:53similar answer, but like how do you use

1:30:54it on a day-to-day basis?

1:30:56>> Yeah. So for copywriting research, but

1:30:58for editing, I think it's super it's

1:31:00super helpful. And I think I'm excited

1:31:02for it to get to a point with editing

1:31:04where, you know, it will cut down the

1:31:07process and the time a lot more because

1:31:08I feel like editing still takes forever,

1:31:11especially with more customized editing

1:31:13styles. But auto captions, that was

1:31:16already a huge game changer and that

1:31:18came out like years ago. So yeah, it's

1:31:21only been getting better, but I'm

1:31:22excited for the day where it can take

1:31:24over editing.

1:31:25>> What does it do for you now? just

1:31:26automatically cut the silences or

1:31:28>> um I would say like auto captions and

1:31:30then some editing styles it can do but

1:31:32you have to kind of refine it a lot

1:31:34after um but it's been helpful with that

1:31:38but since like short form is kind of

1:31:40different like I could see it in a long

1:31:42form podcast cutting out all the

1:31:44silences or the ones that like

1:31:45automatically switch the camera to

1:31:47whoever's talking can be so helpful.

1:31:49>> Yeah, that's that's how we've used it

1:31:50particularly. Um I'm kind of picky with

1:31:53it though and tell my editors to redo

1:31:55it. There's one called Autopod that's

1:31:57fairly good.

1:31:57>> Oh,

1:31:58>> yeah. I have someone in the podcast

1:32:00niche and we literally just wrote a

1:32:01script about that,

1:32:02>> like how to use it. But yeah,

1:32:05>> interesting.

1:32:05>> And like what do you think?

1:32:08>> Yeah, it's just uh

1:32:10>> it's not it's not great cuz I'm just

1:32:12picky about how I want it.

1:32:13>> Like I want like I think about a lot of

1:32:15content from the emotional perspective.

1:32:17Like if I say something profound,

1:32:20>> I would have the camera cut to your face

1:32:22there. But the AI is not going to do

1:32:23that automatically, you know, um because

1:32:26>> like the good content is in things that

1:32:29AI can't pick up right now. I wish there

1:32:31was prompts you could write

1:32:33>> like uh edit this video and remove

1:32:36anything that's like emotionally

1:32:38uninteresting and like I wish it could

1:32:40pick up things like that. Um or like

1:32:42remove everything about this topic or

1:32:46remove like when they speak in this

1:32:48tone. Um that kind of stuff would be

1:32:50nice with AI. But

1:32:52>> have you played with any of like the

1:32:53Google VO uh stuff yet?

1:32:56>> No, I haven't.

1:32:57>> Gotcha. Yeah, I played with that

1:32:58yesterday or the day before. Um

1:33:00>> what exactly is that?

1:33:01>> It basically it's the first AI that can

1:33:04make videos from prompts with speech.

1:33:07>> Oh.

1:33:07>> So I could like make a video of us

1:33:09talking on this podcast. It wouldn't

1:33:11look like us. Um but it could say things

1:33:14in a very conversational way. Um you

1:33:16used to be like you could do that before

1:33:18but you would have to like use different

1:33:19softwares. But it's the and labs and

1:33:21stuff.

1:33:21>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

1:33:22>> But it's the first time that you can

1:33:24like straight prompt to videos of people

1:33:26like interviewing each other or like

1:33:28talking about a product. Um

1:33:30>> it's kind of scary.

1:33:31>> Yeah. You I'll have to show clips of it.

1:33:34Uh it's really like realistic looking.

1:33:36Um

1:33:37>> yeah, I've seen I saw this video today

1:33:39and it was like so random. It's like a

1:33:422023 AI video of Will Smith eating

1:33:46spaghetti and the 2025 version. And it's

1:33:49crazy like how much AI's improved.

1:33:52>> What's one small detail in a video that

1:33:54makes a huge difference?