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Çilingir Sofrası 31 / Platon, Psukhe, Atman, Brahman (with English subtitles)

Çilingir Sofrası · 1,957 words · 9 min read

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0:01Çilingir Sofrası 31 / Plato, Psyche, Atman, Brahman ***Translated by Prof.Dr.Nükhet Kardam***

0:03All right, we still haven’t gotten to India

0:06Now at one time a close friend of mine

0:13Believed in some gossip that he had heard about me

0:20He loved me, but he was influenced by

0:27A group of people who disliked me and

0:30who did not want to have anything to do with me

0:33So he couldn’t come near me, but one day he came to a meeting I was at

0:39and sat in a far corner, this was such a good friend in the past

0:42Before we hugged each other at every opportunity

0:48But now he thought that I would be a bad influence

0:52This kind of thing happens, it is not unusual.

0:57When I looked toward him

0:59He averted his eyes.

1:02He was in a difficult spot.

1:05He was right

1:07Serhan: He was stuck in duality.

1:09I am the kind of person who can’t remember any song’s words

1:18But somehow, I don’t know how it came to me

1:22But at that moment, I started singing the words of the song:

1:25(Music) ‘Don’t just walk around dear, come inside’

1:31Come, come inside. He heard me and came inside

1:37and now we are back to hugging each other

1:39We delight in each other’s company.

1:42When we just walk around

1:46that means we are in doubt.

1:50But the believers walk inside.

1:54They are sure of themselves, and they join the sohbet and have muhabbet (love for each other)

2:05Now, what is Vedanta?

2:09Veda is knowledge

2:14and Anta means purpose or aim

2:18So Vedanta is purposeful knowledge

2:23Or goal oriented knowledge

2:29Not causal knowledge but goal oriented knowledge

2:37It is reciprocal. This means we are already in agreement about the goal. If we are not already in agreement, it can’t work.

2:44We have accepted it. If you have a goal, an idea, a utopia in mind

2:50A hope for the future

2:57That’s when you are in a creative mode, otherwise you would live like animals

3:03Instead of going around and around, come inside and see the images, the ideas that will take you to the future

3:08In art, we call this futurism

3:12To live in the future. In religion we call it eschatology

3:16Human beings are created from the future, not from the past

3:20What is created from the past is the ‘besher’ (the body)

3:27Human beings are created by God

3:32God creates you and you get transformed from ‘besher’ to ‘insan’ (human being)

3:39Then you are saved from idolizing the body and realize that the body is just a garment

3:45A garment, you then take off that garment

3:48And appear in the presence of God just like Prophet David

3:54Allah Eyvallah, so now

3:58According to the later Vedanta writings and what was developed in the Upanishads

4:06The multiplicity that we see externally

4:09Disappears in our unifying consciousness and

4:13that is the ‘nafs’

4:17See how ‘nafs’ is defined here

4:20Serhan: It is defined as unifying

4:22The multiplicity that we see outside belongs to the senses

4:26But our consciousness unifies them around a purpose, an aim (Veda Anta)

4:38Serhan: A beautiful explanation

4:40And that’s the nafs

4:45Check out this teaching!

4:49Now, if we had gone to ancient Greece

4:55We have gone there at times for touristic visits

5:00We know that Plato tells us the same thing.

5:04He says that we can see and perceive the multiplicity.

5:16But it is logos, consciousness

5:21That brings them into unity

5:27And owns it. He calls this ‘psyche’. It is the same thing as nafs.

5:33Now, at the beginning of our sohbets, we said that spirituality is similar to artesian wells

5:41They are like an underground river, but you can see where they spring up

5:46You think that’s the only place where they have sprung up

5:50Because you see what is above ground, not what is underneath

5:54You can’t see what’s hidden

5:59The underground rivers

6:02But these wells have sprung up in Greece, in India, and in Egypt from the same underground river

6:07What shall we do now?

6:10Check the taste of the water

6:13Serhan: Maybe they all come from the same river

6:15It is not maybe, I am telling you

6:19What is being said in India thousands years ago and what Plato says are the same

6:25We know that this is also in Islam,

6:28but they were first.

6:32This is unexpected. We might expect this wisdom to evolve over time

6:37Whereas they appeared already evolved to this level. How can this be?

6:41We say people who lived there were not evolved yet, aborigines lived there

6:50How could such wisdom have appeared?

6:54Because there is evolution

6:58And evolution has its stages,

7:01and not everyone has evolved at the same time all of a sudden

7:05Or at the same level, depending on history, climate, experiences

7:11It is the same with biological evolution

7:13In spiritual evolution, we see this today

7:18Look at the people’s faces who have used their brains,

7:24acquired universal knowledge in both theory and experience!

7:32And then look at the face of a villager like myself

7:35Look at both faces

7:37The intellectual face shines brightly

7:40because the face is the mirror of the spirit

7:44I am not saying the face of a villager is bad but

7:46the former’s face is refined

7:48Whereas the face of a villager is tough, heroic, it shows the challenges of nature

7:57The other face is graceful, refined, especially if he or she is involved in artistic endeavors

8:05Such a person is in a different state, this is not related to the body but is still reflected in the body

8:11And that state is attractive

8:13That’s what I mean when I say that spirituality is something artistic

8:17So some people manifest this, others may not.

8:26But we ask: Why are all Indians not like that?

8:30Look at mountains, the monasteries are at the top of the mountain, such as in Tibet

8:35Why are they built at the top of mountains?

8:39There is the issue of up and down

8:42Those who are willing to put up the effort get to the top.

8:45Serhan: Let those who are willing to put out the effort come

8:47Then they go through a refining process, become monks

8:54and see God’s beauty

8:55write about it, and understand it

8:57Don’t expect this from people who have not made the effort to climb to the top.

8:59They ask, why are people in India less developed?

9:02Well, because they live at the bottom of the mountain

9:05What can we do about it?

9:07They need to go up the mountain.

9:09Moses went up the mountain

9:12So did Prophet Muhammed

9:19Christ climbed up to the grove of olive trees

9:25They have all gone up a mountain.

9:29What does this mean?

9:30That means you need to go up to the top of your mountain,

9:33not to any mountain where you will only find flowers and insects

9:38To find Veda Anta, you must look for your purpose

9:49The unchanging unity (Vahdet) can only occur in consciousness

9:55How does the individual reach unity?

9:58The individual self must empty him/herself

10:03From all content considered his/her own

10:09This is what we call reaching Atman

10:13To reach Atman.

10:15Atman is a Turkish word

10:17Turks ruled over Indians, the Chinese and Persians as you know

10:27All civilizations have their specific talents

10:32Turks have two talents.

10:35One is courage, willingness to die

10:39And the other is administration

10:42They went to India and administered India, same with Persia

10:53But Turks don’t have other talents

10:54For example, they are not talented in philosophy like the Greeks,

11:00In artistic talents again like the Greeks,

11:04or law like the Romans

11:10Anglosaxons are good at politics

11:14What do Turks have?

11:17They have never become slaves

11:21Arabs invaded Horasan (where Turks lived), but the men never surrendered and died instead

11:31They made slaves out of children but children are not yet capable of knowing themselves therefore they were not responsible

11:39They took the women by force

11:41and turned them into ‘cariye’ servants.

11:43What we have here in this society now is Arab traditions

11:49They have turned this society’s children (Turks in the region of Horasan at that time) into slaves, the men were killed

11:54Women were forcibly taken

11:57The traditions we have now came from Arabs

12:02Arabs came to Horasan and killed 10,000 people

12:06Hung people on trees

12:10Made women into servants and killed all the men

12:17We accept this slavehood

12:23Who accepted it?

12:24Not the people of wisdom,

12:26not lovers of God

12:32No

12:34So who accepted it?

12:37Only the ignorant accepted it,

12:39the educated people didn’t accept it.

12:42Those who are considered educated were not really ‘alim’ because they did not possess wisdom.

12:45And knowledge without wisdom doesn’t work.

12:49But lets not go there now

12:52Wherever you are, whether you are in Europe or America,

12:59if a person accepts another society’s traditions as their religion,

13:04she or he is no longer authentic.

13:09So come back to yourself or know yourself means free yourself from slavehood

13:14And become authentic

13:17Whoever can free themselves from slavehood becomes Allah’s beloved servant

13:23Such a person would never bow in front of anyone except Allah

13:26La Ilahe Illallah means this

13:29La ilahe means giving up your idols,

13:31it is not a joke

13:33Shall I translate it?

13:35People want to become Muslim, they ask, am I a Muslim?

13:39If you don’t implement the first principle, you will never find Allah

13:43La ilahe means let go of all your idols!

13:50Become an atheist!

13:53Allah won’t manifest in you without becoming an atheist first

13:57It is not enough to recite La Ilahe Illallah, you have to actually live it

14:10First break your idols,

14:12empty out the Kaaba!

14:16That’s when you will find Atman

14:22Atman is proto-Turkish, I said. why?

14:27It means Ataman, meaning Godlike man

14:35It is not a Hindu word,

14:38it is not a Sanskrit word

14:43Brahman isn’t a Sanskrit word either

14:49There is the B at the beginnign of Brahman, B is the ‘besmele’

14:58All cultures have the same thing is what I mean

15:02We need archeologists,

15:05if you open the dictionary to look at the meaning of ‘archeology’

15:12It is a philosophical concept and

15:17means looking at what is beyond or behind, and looking for what comes first

15:23arche - o - logy

15:27What is beyond consciousness, the first causes

15:31Let’s look at what is behind our consciousness, its first causes

15:34Does archeology do this?

15:37No

15:39We look at how people practice archeology

15:42They examine external objects, old cultural artifacts

15:44And claim to be archeologists

15:46Thats not real archeology

15:48That’s not it,

15:51it is about exploring how linguistic concepts arose as human consciousness evolved

15:59Otherwise, why should we be talking about Indian wisdom?

16:07This is not about acquiring knowledge

16:11This is not about a flashback.

16:13Instead it is being fed by what came first, going to the source, to our Rab

16:18And acquire the ability to be reborn, to be recreated in order to meet our Rab.

16:22It is about reorganizing our consciousness.

16:27This is the purpose of our sohbets. We are not interested in providing knowledge

16:33Or to show people how much we know

16:35Look at our table, we only have some water and some tea

16:39Sinan: Our purpose is obvious

16:41This is Veda Anta.

16:45People without an aim are like animals

16:50The Qur’an says that such people

16:54Are even lower than animals,

16:57why?

17:00Human beings have the ability to know themselves

17:02Animals don’t have the consciousness to know themselves

17:07But human beings do, but still don’t try. That’s why such people are considered lower than animals

17:12Serhan: Animals don’t know

17:13Animals, with their nafs, are God’s angels

17:22The Qur’an is full of inspiration for those who look

17:28not for those who are blind

17:31Çilingir Sofrası 31 / Plato, Psyche, Atman, Brahman ***Translated by Prof.Dr.Nükhet Kardam***

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