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0:05Now, amid galloping defections from the
0:08PDP to the APC and all the grim
0:12predictions about the imminent demise of
0:14the main opposition party, another
0:17deadly blow as former senator and media
0:20entrepreneur Ben Murray Bruce switches
0:23allegiance. Mr. Murray Bruce, of course,
0:26a key political figure and a once
0:29prominent voice in the PDP. His move to
0:32the APC dramatically weakens the
0:35opposition in Belsa State and diminishes
0:38its influence in the Niger Delta region
0:40and indeed across Nigeria. Citing
0:43President Tinibu's economic and security
0:46reforms as reasons for his departure,
0:49Mr. Murray Bruce praised the
0:51administration's efforts to stabilize
0:53the economy and rebuild investor
0:56confidence. But even as the impact of
0:59his defection sears through opposition
1:02ranks, further pushing the PDP into the
1:05margins, a few hopeful voices continue
1:09to attempt to inspire resilience,
1:11warning that the APC is failing to heal
1:14Nigeria and is fracturing this country's
1:17democracy almost beyond repair,
1:20signaling a new world of political
1:23disorder. So if true, what does this
1:26disorder and this sense of democratic
1:29decline mean for Nigeria's future?
1:34Well, for more on this, I'm joined now
1:36in the studio by the media entrepreneur
1:38and former senator representing Belsa
1:40East, Ben Murray Bruce. Uh Mr. Murray
1:43Bruce, thank you very much indeed for
1:45joining us.
1:46>> Thank you. Thank you.
1:47>> It's no longer a trickle, is it? Yeah,
1:49>> it's a veritable flood from the PDP to
1:52the APC and you were one of those who
1:54turned it into a flood. How has it come
1:58to this for you who for decades was one
2:01of the most prominent voices in the PDP?
2:04What specific issues have driven you to
2:08abandon the party that nurtured you
2:11politically?
2:12>> I think it's about leadership. It's not
2:14the party. Forget about party. Parties
2:16irrelevant. It's about the man at the
2:18top. Uh, President Tinbu has shown that
2:20he can lead Nigeria. He can fix the
2:22economy. He can put together a dream
2:24team. And what people complain about is
2:29they want immediate results. That's not
2:31going to happen. If you had surgery and
2:34you're in a hospital, you need time to
2:36recover. Nigeria is in very bad shape.
2:37We've been very badly led. When I was in
2:39the Senate, I raised it a million times
2:41when President Buhari wanted to borrow
2:43money. I voted against every single time
2:46they wanted to borrow money because I
2:48knew they couldn't service the debt.
2:50They didn't have the capacity.
2:52It got to a point where 97% of our
2:54earnings was used to service debt. Now I
2:56think it's about 50%. If you don't have
2:58the talent at the top, why am I going to
3:00give you any money? You can't service
3:01the debt. It doesn't matter if what you
3:03want to use it for is productive. So I'm
3:06not driven by party politics. I'm driven
3:08by the individual who runs the country
3:11and the dream team that runs the
3:12economy. That's what drives me. I'm not
3:14in office. I'm not a senator. I'm not a
3:16governor. I'm not a Senate President.
3:18So, it's not like if I support the
3:20center, I'm going to get a big check in
3:22my local government the next day. So,
3:23I'm doing it for the right reasons. And
3:25I think people who switch parties,
3:27whatever position they take, they have
3:28to do it for the right reason, not
3:31because of some immediate gratification
3:33that may or may not come. M well you
3:35touched on this briefly but I mean you
3:37were quite critical. You said it's not
3:39about party it's about the person but
3:41let's face it is about the party because
3:44the party is part of the train and the
3:46baggage. You were quite critical of the
3:48APC in the past. I mean what made you
3:52change your mind?
3:52>> Because of the bad leadership. I voted
3:55against everything Bhari did in the
3:57Senate and I'm proud of what I did. If I
4:00was in the Senate today, I'll vote for
4:02President Batinubu's policies because it
4:04makes sense. Look, every single
4:07president since I was a kid in this
4:09country I have known personally. So, I'm
4:12not some guy who reads about them from
4:15Gawan with his vice president uh Admiral
4:19Wei. He used to be in the house all the
4:20time. He was like my uncle all the way
4:22to the president. When Abassenger was
4:24president, I lived with the president in
4:26the villa. I lived in house 8 for four
4:28years. So I've worked with President
4:30Bolatinu. I mean apparently to Abas I've
4:33worked with Good Luck Jonathan. I know
4:35all these guys. I know all of them. I
4:36know their capabilities. I know their
4:38capacity. Bolatinu is smart. Please
4:41understand he's very very intelligent.
4:44He is very very smart. He understands
4:46policies. When he was running for
4:47president one day I was with him. I said
4:50you're going to appoint 42 ministers 36
4:53ministers. Some of them are political
4:54appointees. You're not going to know
4:55them. how you going to make sure they
4:58can run the economy and he said to me
5:00all I care about all I need are eight
5:02ministers and I will run Nigeria the
5:05dream team and that's what he has done
5:07finance we um CBN Yikadoso the NSA uh
5:14Nuadu and Umahi for for works to name a
5:18few. Now these guys are in the front
5:21line and these guys have made a
5:23difference to the economy. Nobody can
5:25deny that. Now inflation is what 18%.
5:28Debt to service ratio is less than what
5:3060% now from 97%.
5:32Consumer confidence is coming back.
5:34You're going to argue that say well
5:36people are suffering on the streets.
5:37Yes, they're suffering on the streets.
5:38It takes a while to fix the economy.
5:40You're not going to fix it overnight. So
5:41people who say but Batinu should fix the
5:44economy over there. That's not going to
5:45happen. It's going to take a while.
5:47Well, you talked about um your
5:51having met and spent time with all
5:53Nigerian presidents in in the more sort
5:56of recent past. I mean, where do you
5:58place president Tinubu in that pecking
6:01order? You said you know their
6:02capabilities
6:03>> in terms of the economies number one.
6:06>> You mean better than Obasenjjo? Better
6:08than
6:08>> Obas took Obasen took over from the
6:11military. It was a horrible time when
6:14Obasenor took over. I was with him in
6:16the villa in the living room one day. I
6:18said, "Mr. President, we're in trouble.
6:20The dollar to the naira rate was $10 to
6:23the 10. Was it no oil? It was $10 to a
6:27barrel of oil." He said, "Ben, don't
6:29worry. It'll get to 15." He said, "It'll
6:32get to 15." He was talking of $15 a
6:34barrel.
6:35>> Now, you're talking of guys who run the
6:37country at $100 a barrel, $75 a barrel.
6:39Obasen took over as a very horrible time
6:42in the history of the country. So you
6:44have to put it in context. What did he
6:46inherit? What happened? Niger need to be
6:48united. Abacha had just died. Uh there
6:51were a lot of problems in the country.
6:53So what Abassenger did was to unite the
6:55country. Obass was not the guy to grow
6:58the economy. We were in big trouble.
6:59>> Yeah. But he also grew the economy
7:01dramatic. He did.
7:02>> I mean he became the biggest economy in
7:04Africa.
7:04>> Right. But if you look at what happened
7:06when he was president versus what
7:08Bolatinu inherited versus what uh
7:11President Jonathan inherited versus what
7:14inherit I mean everybody ran the country
7:17at a different time in the history of
7:19Nigeria. So yes he did a great job
7:23was a great finance minister. He had a
7:25dream team
7:27>> had a dream team.
7:29Uh Bolatinbu has a dream team. Babatimbu
7:33took over from a very horrible time.
7:35Look when Obasen took over the nar to
7:39the dollar was what? Um
7:43can you remember?
7:43>> I can't remember.
7:44>> I can't remember now. But it was
7:46terrible that but when Bulla took over
7:49what 1500 to one that was the worst time
7:52in the history of the country it was
7:55horrible. No, it wasn't actually 15001.
7:58It was a lot lower than that. It was
8:02after he took the
8:04>> it regulated.
8:05>> Yeah. He destroyed the policies that he
8:07did that it skyrocketed.
8:08>> It skyrocketed
8:09>> and then came down a little bit,
8:11>> right?
8:12>> So people are still I mean limping from
8:14the wound of this.
8:15>> I know. But it's a free market economy.
8:18But it's a free market economy.
8:19>> Yeah. But but that's those are those are
8:20economic theories. I mean, when you when
8:23you talk about the impact of all of that
8:25on the ordinary person in Nigeria, in
8:27fact, the majority of Nigerians, that's
8:29what really counts, isn't it? I mean, it
8:31doesn't matter what the figures look
8:33like on a computer screen.
8:34>> You're right. But it takes a while to
8:36fix the problem. I'm no economist,
8:38>> right? Well, let me
8:39>> is not the economy,
8:40>> right? Let let me move away from that
8:42because you must know that a lot of
8:44people will see your defection as
8:47opportunistic. I mean, you are said to
8:49be owing the asset management
8:52corporation of Nigeria or Amcon about 10
8:54billion naira. They've seized your
8:57Silver Bird Entertainment Center in a
8:59bid to recover the money. So, people in
9:01the PDP and beyond are already saying
9:05that this move to the APC is a survival
9:08move for you. How do you respond to
9:10this?
9:10>> That's a bunch of nonsense.
9:12Am already has the asset.
9:16They own the asset now. So what purpose
9:20would it serve if I APC or AD or or PDP
9:24or or whatever party I belong to? They
9:26already have the asset.
9:27>> Well, there's always this notion in
9:28Nigeria that if you join the APC, all
9:32your troubles disappear.
9:34>> That's not true. I think I think
9:36everybody forgets what people stand for,
9:38what you stand for as a human being.
9:41Borat Timbu has been my friend for 40
9:44years. Do I believe he's a great man and
9:48he can fix the economy? Yes, I do.
9:49>> Yeah, but that's all the more reason if
9:51he's been your friend that people think
9:52that if you affiliate yourself with him
9:55politically,
9:56>> then perhaps um your your troubles will
9:58go away.
9:59>> Peter is my personal friend. One day
10:02we're in London. We walked the streets
10:03of London with one umbrella and did
10:0530,000 steps. Okay.
10:08Atiku Abuaka is my personal friend.
10:11President Obasen is my personal friend.
10:14In fact, the other day I met the former
10:17IG who went on TV to announce that I
10:20should be arrested because I was
10:22thinking of attacking the uh force head
10:26headquarters when we protested against
10:28uh how the police was behaving while we
10:31were on the floor of the Senate. I met
10:32him the other day and we became friends.
10:34So look, those things don't bother me.
10:35People say what they want to say. This
10:36is politics,
10:37>> right? But but I mean, did you get any
10:40asurances from the APC? Did you receive
10:43any guarant?
10:52>> No one.
10:54>> Last night,
10:54>> you didn't consult anybody.
10:56>> Nobody. Last night at 2:00 in the
10:58morning, APC chairman called me to
11:00congratulate to congratulate me for
11:02joining APC. Hopima who had not seen for
11:04six months called me last night to
11:06congratulate me. You called me at 1:00
11:09in the morning to start up this
11:10interview. Uh uh and so many other
11:13people called. I don't consult people
11:14for decision I made. When I ran for
11:16governor in bio, I consulted no one.
11:18That was my decision. When I ran for the
11:20Senate, I consulted no one. That's my
11:21decision. I don't operate like a typical
11:24traditional politician. I do what I like
11:26to do. If it makes sense, then I do it.
11:29I support you and I don't care who is
11:31against you. If I believe in you, I
11:34support you. If I don't believe in you,
11:36I'm a courageous guy. I will tell the
11:38world I don't like you. Therefore, I I
11:42consulted no one. And if anybody says I
11:44consulted them, they they are free to
11:46come here tomorrow morning on your
11:47program to tell me how and when I
11:49consulted them to join the APC. I
11:51consult no one. It's my decision. Beyond
11:53all that, I mean, how will you address
11:56public concerns particularly in Belsa
11:59State where you come from and which you
12:01represented in the Senate under the PDP
12:05about your loyalty and integrity because
12:07as I'm sure you know defection can
12:10damage one's reputation and many of
12:13those people voted for you as a PDP
12:16person. How do you plan to restore that
12:19trust?
12:19>> Charles, I'm not in office. I'm not a
12:22senator. I was in the eighth senate.
12:25So I'm not in office.
12:27>> Yeah, but you're still a politician.
12:29>> Yeah, but I'm not in office. I'm not a
12:31minister. I'm not a senator.
12:33>> But but but you I mean as a senator now
12:36former senator.
12:37>> I'm a former senator. Yeah. I'm a
12:39businessman.
12:39>> You were elected on the PDP platform. Do
12:42you feel as a result of
12:44>> How do you feel? How do you feel when
12:46you divorce your fourth wife?
12:47>> Well, I haven't got a fourth wife, I'm
12:50afraid. Okay, but because your third
12:52wife you're going to apologize, you're
12:54going to apologize for the rest of your
12:56life.
12:56>> Do you feel
12:57>> How many wives do you have?
12:58>> No, but what I'm saying is that do you
12:59feel accountable to those constituents
13:02who voted for you? I mean, I know you're
13:04no longer in office. No, I don't I don't
13:06feel I feel accountable to the people of
13:08Nigeria to make if I'm considered one of
13:11the leaders, I feel accountable to the
13:13people of Nigeria to make the right
13:15decisions to help this country, not just
13:18BSA, north, south, east, west. I have an
13:21obligation as a prominent citizen of
13:23this country to tell the people that
13:26President Bolatinu is doing the right
13:29things to save this economy. And that's
13:30that's
13:31>> But you didn't have to join the APC to
13:33do that. I
13:34>> don't have to. But I did. I didn't have
13:35to join the PDP either.
13:36>> Yeah. But why did you join the APC?
13:37>> I could have been a pope. I could have
13:39joined.
13:40>> I like that. It would have been
13:41interesting to see you as the pope.
13:43>> Okay. I could have been the pope. I
13:44could have I could have I could have
13:45been an astronaut. I could have been a
13:46race.
13:47>> Why did you join the APC?
13:48>> Because I felt as a person that he done
13:52such a great job. I challenged him when
13:53he was running for office. I challenged
13:55him on the policies he would take. But
13:58you could have supported him without
13:59being a member of the APC. I mean yes
14:03is a member of the PDP. He's not he's
14:05not working for BBC. Why did you come to
14:08Lagos to work for a ride? You could have
14:09stayed in London.
14:10>> Well, I'm in Abuja, right?
14:10>> In Abuja. Okay. Why do you why you could
14:12have stayed in London to work for BBC?
14:14You didn't have to go and work for
14:15>> Well, because I I feel a sense of
14:17commitment to Nigeria.
14:18>> I feel a sense of
14:19>> And I like Dar.
14:21>> Yeah. Yeah. I feel a sense of commitment
14:23to President Bolatinu and I feel like
14:25look, let me give you let Fair enough.
14:27>> Let me give you an example. Let me give
14:28you an example and this is what annoys
14:30me.
14:30>> There was a picture taken by Remy Tinbu
14:32and the president when he won. Everybody
14:35criticized why she should be by the
14:37president in the V. And I've been in
14:39that office a million times with several
14:40presidents.
14:42>> What upsets me then was she had been a
14:45senator for 12 years. She's probably the
14:48most qualified first lady this country
14:50has ever seen. And yet some clown
14:53criticizes her for standing by the
14:55president. She was a lawmaker. I was
14:56there for only four years and I think
14:58I'm pretty respected. She was there for
15:0012 years. I worked with her in several
15:02committees is incredibly brilliant,
15:04smart and she got criticized by standing
15:07by the president of Nigeria
15:10as a three-time senator and the people
15:13who work for her said nothing. And I
15:15think people criticize for the sake of
15:17being critical and people don't think
15:19and people must think and that is why
15:20you're here working for Arise. You're
15:22not working for the BBC full-time
15:23anymore.
15:24>> Right.
15:25>> So So what's your take on the current
15:27state of the PDP? Do do you think the
15:30party is beyond redemption or can it be
15:32salvaged?
15:32>> No, it'll be salvaged. This is just a
15:34phase that's going through. Look,
15:35everybody goes through this. General
15:36Bassinger was president, he dismitted
15:38every every other political party. All
15:40came back. Somebody said PDP will rule
15:43for a million years. Now they out of
15:44office. All these things is irrelevant.
15:46It's personal interest and people's
15:48desire. People say why go to the center?
15:51What benefits do I have by being in the
15:53center? I want what's best for Nigeria.
15:54I'm not in office. People in office, a
15:57local government chairman that goes from
15:58PDP or AD to PDP. How does it benefit
16:02the local government chairman?
16:05Because he goes to a party that's in the
16:07center. It's totally irrelevant. If they
16:09have nothing to say, be quiet. It's
16:11totally irrelevant. If you decide to
16:13join APC, explain why you want to join
16:15APC and I just told you about I want to
16:17join APC because Bolatinbo is done a
16:20terrific job. I would say today, I'll
16:22say tomorrow and if he isn't, I will
16:25tell him. But right now, he is. So, I'm
16:27very proud of him.
16:28>> Right. As as I said, I mean, that's not
16:31necessarily enough reason for you to
16:33leave your part. You can still say he's
16:35doing
16:35>> Are you speaking for me? Are you
16:36speaking?
16:36>> No, I'm not speaking for you. Yes, you
16:38are. I'm asking
16:39>> You're speaking You're saying to me,
16:40Charles, you're saying to me, you're
16:42saying to me, you're saying to me, you
16:44are not satisfied with the reason I have
16:46given you for joining the APC. I can say
16:48to you, I'm not satisfied with the
16:50reason you gave for marrying your fourth
16:51wife.
16:52>> Right. Okay. Well, what message do you
16:54have for your former PDP colleagues?
16:57>> If I decide to run, when I run, I will
17:01explain the benefit of a leader that has
17:04common sense, a leader that can change
17:06this country. We've had enough clowns
17:10ruling us at various levels. People
17:13called me the other day and said, "Oh,
17:14you in the Senate, you were pushing the
17:16green car, I mean electric cars, green
17:18energy, whatever it is." And I said, I
17:21was pushing it because it made sense. On
17:23my last day when I was working when I
17:24when you leave the Senate, you make a
17:26speech. When I my last speech in the
17:28Senate, I said for the ninth Senate, I
17:31urge all senators to learn how to read
17:33>> because when you when when you lead a
17:36country, you lead from the front.
17:38>> You talk about the future. We have to
17:40get rid of leaders who talk about the
17:42past. What does the past got to do? Run
17:44a modern day the economy. He bless the
17:46modern day the economy and we should be
17:48proud of him. Looking back, would you
17:50have done anything differently in your
17:53PDP political journey or was this
17:55defection always part of the plan? In
17:58other words, at the back of your mind,
18:00if you felt unsatisfied with the PDP
18:05rather than staying there to fix the
18:07problem or if you felt that the new
18:09president in a different party was doing
18:11a good job, rather than stand on the
18:13sidelines and applaud him, defection was
18:16the answer. In both cases,
18:18>> it seems that you are obsessed with
18:20speaking for me.
18:21>> No, I'm not speaking for I'm asking you
18:22a question.
18:23>> You want to speak for me?
18:24>> No, I am asking you a question so you
18:25can answer.
18:26>> My thought process is this.
18:28>> When I'm in a position, when I'm in
18:31power, when I'm in a fight, I fight for
18:34the just cause for my people. If it can
18:37be fixed, I'll fix it. If I can't If it
18:40can't be fixed, I'll fight you. And if I
18:42find out that I can't win the fight,
18:44I'll abandon you. Okay. When I was on
18:48the floor of the Senate, I believed in
18:50my cause. I believed in what I was
18:52fighting for.
18:53>> What was your cause?
18:54>> I believed in green energy. I believed
18:57in full employment. I believe in
18:59stabilization of the currency. I
19:01believed that there should be um we
19:04should get rid of his illegal uh mining
19:06of oil in the Niger Delta. I believed in
19:09deregulation. All the policies that
19:11President Tinbu is embarking on.
19:13Everything I did on the floor of the
19:15Senate is exactly what he's doing as
19:16president.
19:17>> No difference.
19:18>> So he ticks all the boxes for you.
19:20>> He ticks all the boxes. So So he ticks
19:21all the boxes. And I said, "What? This
19:23guy is doing exactly the things I talked
19:26about." And those of you who have been
19:29to President Tinu, and I say this a
19:31million times, he reads. He's a smart
19:33guy. You go to his office in Bodilon.
19:36There's a library, books behind him, and
19:38he reads. If a commissioner sends a
19:41document for him to sign, he reads. He
19:43doesn't just take the he reads and
19:45because he's smart as a person, I
19:48believe in what he's doing and he ticks
19:51the boxes and he has the right policies
19:54to fix Nigeria's problem. And I'm sorry
19:57for those at home now and I'm speaking
19:59to you directly. It's not going to
20:00happen overnight. It's going to take a
20:02while. It's a painful process. I am not
20:05the Minister of Information. I'm not
20:07speaking on their behalf, but I'm
20:08explaining this is going to take a while
20:11to be fixed.
20:12>> Some people are warning that these mass
20:15defections to the APC, including yours,
20:18of course, are fracturing this country's
20:21democracy almost beyond repair,
20:24signaling a new world of political
20:26disorder where there is no opposition.
20:29Do you agree? If so, what does this
20:32disorder and the sense of democratic
20:35decline mean for Nigeria?
20:38>> Democratic decline is a process. Look,
20:41somebody will show up somewhere,
20:42disagree with the president's policies,
20:44set up another party, create some
20:46alignment, and create incredible force.
20:49>> Yeah, but you're weakening the
20:51opposition. I mean this gale of
20:53defections to use a cliche
20:56>> is weakening the opposition because the
20:58main opposition party is the PDP and and
21:01this all these defections are whittling
21:03its influence down.
21:05>> There will be look
21:08things get destroyed
21:10for others to show up.
21:11>> There will be other parties. It may not
21:13be called the PDP but there will be
21:15opposition.
21:15>> In other words, it's a dialectical
21:17process.
21:18>> There'll be other polit. So what? So PDP
21:20dies, so it dies. Somebody is going to
21:22show up. Somebody will show up for sure.
21:24There will be opposition. There will be
21:25election. There are people who will
21:27challenge the president and it's going
21:28to be a tough election. It's going to be
21:30very tough. Don't think because PDP is
21:32half dead means the democratic process
21:35is dead. I think it feels that way.
21:37People think that way. But somebody will
21:40emerge. A leader will show up and there
21:42will be tough opposition. PB is not
21:44dead. Quacko is not dead. Atiku is not
21:48dead. So there will be opposition
21:51>> but by your own sort of rationale and
21:54your own assessment you would like it if
21:57PTO and Tiku and all these people joined
22:00the the the APC and sort of
22:02>> No, I never said that.
22:03>> began supporting President Trump.
22:05>> No, I never said that. I'm not
22:06campaigning for them to join the APC. I
22:09like Peter. He's my friend. I like what
22:11he's doing. He will never join the APC.
22:14He will run a presidential campaign. I
22:16think we run a presidential campaign.
22:18And that's democracy. So you believe
22:20that it's important for that democracy
22:22that you talk about that there is a
22:23viable opposition.
22:25>> Definitely. I want a viable opposition.
22:27I am supporting President Tinbu because
22:31I truly believe he's the best candidate
22:34at this time to lead this country with a
22:37mess created by his predecessor. That is
22:40my personal
22:40>> his predecessor from the same APC party.
22:42>> So So wait, I support the individual,
22:45not the party.
22:47If his predecessor was in office,
22:49there's no way in the world I would have
22:50joined the party. Impossible.
22:53Bulatinbu is the reason I'm joining the
22:55party. His predecessor, I would never
22:57join the party. Impossible. What would
23:00be the logic?
23:01>> Well, I don't know. What would be the
23:02logic? You're the one.
23:04>> No, I voted against all his policies, so
23:05I could have joined the party. Then I'd
23:07be a bloody traitor.
23:09>> So, so what now? um, Senator Ben Murray
23:12Bruce for your political future? Are you
23:16looking to run for office under the APC
23:19banner? If so, what makes you think you
23:21actually have a chance?
23:23>> First of all, I've not thought about
23:24that. All I think about is the country
23:26right now. I've not thought about me
23:28running for office crossed my mind. Like
23:30I said, when I joined the APC and I left
23:32PDP, it was my decision and my decision
23:34alone. I consulted no one. If and when
23:37that comes, I'll let you know. right
23:39now. That's not what I've been thinking
23:40about. All I think about now is the
23:42country. Cuz the country works, I work,
23:45>> right? So, what now for your political
23:49future? I'm not thinking about that. I'm
23:51thinking about the country first. I got
23:52a business. I have a business in Ghana.
23:54I have a business in Los Angeles. I have
23:56a business in Lagos. I have a business
23:58in in in about six different states in
24:01the country. I got I I'm a busy guy.
24:03I've got lots of stuff that I'm doing
24:05and I got to fix those things. I want to
24:07make movies and I want to enjoy my life.
24:10>> Well, I have to say that I'm come visit
24:12you in London.
24:13>> Well, I have to say that I enjoy going
24:15to your cinema here in I mean, that's
24:17about the only cinema that actually
24:19works, you know, thank you very much.
24:20>> And and you tend to get the movie the
24:22most current movies. In fact, I think
24:24you're on the same timeline as the
24:26American. So once it comes out, it comes
24:28out.
24:29>> We get we get it at the same time. But
24:30you should come see my studio in Los
24:32Angeles. It's beautiful. Well, one of
24:34these days, uh, I shall trundle in,
24:37>> try, you'll be my guest.
24:38>> In the meantime, I want to thank you
24:40very much indeed for coming in. Um, Ben
24:43Murray Bruce is a media entrepreneur and
24:45former senator representing BISA East.
24:48Thank you.
24:48>> There's something I want to say.
24:49>> Yeah, of course.
24:51>> You know, there's something that made a
24:53big difference in my mind about
24:56President Tinu. when he was governor
24:58he was trying to reclaim the Atlantic
25:01Ocean with Ronald Shuguri which is now a
25:03coat Atlantic and I was mediating
25:06between the federal government and Lagos
25:08state
25:10was the minister of works from Lagos
25:14working for a passenger and there was a
25:15dispute
25:16>> they wouldn't give Lagos the right to
25:18claim the land that is now Echo Atlantic
25:22I was exasperated and one day I went to
25:24Bodilon to see Governor Tinwood
25:28and I said, "Governor, I am tired. The
25:31really the federal government because of
25:34the laws at the time would not allow us
25:36reclaim the Atlantic Ocean to create
25:38what is now EcoAtlantic, the most
25:40expensive real estate on Earth." He
25:44stood up and he said, "Ben, let me ask
25:46you a question. Are you standing on
25:48quicksand or firm ground?"
25:51I said, "On firm ground." He said, "Ben,
25:53if you're standing on firm ground, you
25:55keep fighting and you will win." That's
25:57the guy he is. I've known him for a long
26:00time. Equat-AtAt Atlantic is a
26:02multi-billion dollar project today. I'm
26:04happy I was part of it. I've known
26:07President Tinbo for a long time. If he
26:10can stand his grounds against the
26:12government at this time and create this
26:14magnificent city, then I urge all
26:17Nigerians to support a wonderful guy
26:19like that. And I'm asking you to go buy
26:21some land and build your house for your
26:23four wives.
26:25>> Why you laughing?
26:26>> Yeah. Well, I I I I one is enough for
26:28me. Thank you very much indeed.
26:30>> But Ben, good to see you. Thank you.
26:32Thanks a lot. Ben Murray Bruce, as I
26:34said, media entrepreneur, former senator
26:37representing Bulsa East and now a newly
26:40minted member of the APC. Thank you very
26:43much indeed. Good to see you again. All
26:44right. Take care.